5 ms·

I think it's mostly a spam/bot mitigation technique. Getting a new phone number costs money and is often difficult to automate.

inetknght 2y ago
It's amazing how much waste our whole world economy incurs as a consequence of not enforcing anti-fraud laws against operators of compute devices.
- master-lincoln 2y ago
  I think that is mostly because the perpetrators are often in a different country than victims. There is no global law or enforcement of rules, but the internet is global. That is a fundamental mismatch in my eyes.
  - dathinab 2y ago
    or ... because huge companies make a ton of money from it and pay lobbyist enough Like it really isn't that rare to have issues where people tell you "nothing can be done, it's from outside of our country" or similar. And then you travel and realize, it's a "your country" issue and many or even most other countries have fixed it or at least massively reduced it and the whole "criminals are in another country" thing didn't prevent them from fixing it... This e.g. is the case for US spam/scam/robo calls (which isn't "fully fixed" anywhere but starkly reduced by in many places including e.g. the EU).
    - gruez 2y ago
      >or ... because huge companies make a ton of money from it and pay lobbyist enough Which companies are making money off frauds like pig butchering scams? I think you're overestimating how competent the state is and underestimating how hard it is to solve problems like these. For instance, we can barely dissuade other countries from buying Iranian and Russian oil, and there's pretty much bipartisan consensus on that.
      - inetknght 2y ago
        > Which companies are making money off frauds like pig butchering scams? Companies that own dating apps. > I think you're overestimating how competent the state is I fully agree. The U.S. state is quite incompetent. > and underestimating how hard it is to solve problems like these "We've tried nothing and we're all out of ideas!" Have you thought of blocking countries that permit malicious activity to cross international borders? Have you thought of blocking their IP addresses? Or is that international money just too good to let a "little bit" of malicious activity befall upon your fellow citizens?
        gruez 2y ago
        >Companies that own dating apps. And they're lobbying against which regulations that would stop them? >Have you thought of blocking countries that permit malicious activity to cross international borders? Have you thought of blocking their IP addresses? The financial system is far more centralized than the internet and at least theoretically has KYC, but US sanctions against enemy states, terrorist groups, and drug gangs are as airtight as a sieve. What makes you so sure that IP blocking countries will have any effect, when anyone can buy a no-log VPN for $5/month?
        inetknght 2y ago
        The grandparent claimed: > I think that is mostly because the perpetrators are often in a different country than victims. So, your comment here is moving the goalpost: > What makes you so sure that IP blocking countries will have any effect, when anyone can buy a no-log VPN for $5/month? If it's malicious activity behind VPNs in foreign countries, then see previous comment about blocking foreign countries. Block foreign countries at the interconnect until they enact and enforce laws which address the malicious activity. If it's malicious activity behind VPNs in your own country then you need only convince your law enforcement to enforce existing computer crime laws. Renting a server for $5/mo requires payment and payment provides a name & address to prosecute. All you need is to demonstrate that the malicious activity originated from the rented IP address and during the rental period.
whywhywhywhy 2y ago
On the one hand it makes spam more difficult on the other hand it makes breaking into someones most personal accounts way more simple, just have to convince the phone carrier customer support and then you get into the Apple account and all their other passwords.
dathinab 2y ago
> cost money yes, but it's surprisingly cheap (if you now where to ask for it and your operation is large enough) could have changed a bit after FTC started pushing a bit more against robocalls and for caller verification idk. a year ago??
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]

inetknght 2y ago

It's amazing how much waste our whole world economy incurs as a consequence of not enforcing anti-fraud laws against operators of compute devices.

master-lincoln 2y ago
I think that is mostly because the perpetrators are often in a different country than victims. There is no global law or enforcement of rules, but the internet is global. That is a fundamental mismatch in my eyes.
- dathinab 2y ago
  or ... because huge companies make a ton of money from it and pay lobbyist enough Like it really isn't that rare to have issues where people tell you "nothing can be done, it's from outside of our country" or similar. And then you travel and realize, it's a "your country" issue and many or even most other countries have fixed it or at least massively reduced it and the whole "criminals are in another country" thing didn't prevent them from fixing it... This e.g. is the case for US spam/scam/robo calls (which isn't "fully fixed" anywhere but starkly reduced by in many places including e.g. the EU).
  - gruez 2y ago
    >or ... because huge companies make a ton of money from it and pay lobbyist enough Which companies are making money off frauds like pig butchering scams? I think you're overestimating how competent the state is and underestimating how hard it is to solve problems like these. For instance, we can barely dissuade other countries from buying Iranian and Russian oil, and there's pretty much bipartisan consensus on that.
    - inetknght 2y ago
      > Which companies are making money off frauds like pig butchering scams? Companies that own dating apps. > I think you're overestimating how competent the state is I fully agree. The U.S. state is quite incompetent. > and underestimating how hard it is to solve problems like these "We've tried nothing and we're all out of ideas!" Have you thought of blocking countries that permit malicious activity to cross international borders? Have you thought of blocking their IP addresses? Or is that international money just too good to let a "little bit" of malicious activity befall upon your fellow citizens?
      - gruez 2y ago
        >Companies that own dating apps. And they're lobbying against which regulations that would stop them? >Have you thought of blocking countries that permit malicious activity to cross international borders? Have you thought of blocking their IP addresses? The financial system is far more centralized than the internet and at least theoretically has KYC, but US sanctions against enemy states, terrorist groups, and drug gangs are as airtight as a sieve. What makes you so sure that IP blocking countries will have any effect, when anyone can buy a no-log VPN for $5/month?
        inetknght 2y ago
        The grandparent claimed: > I think that is mostly because the perpetrators are often in a different country than victims. So, your comment here is moving the goalpost: > What makes you so sure that IP blocking countries will have any effect, when anyone can buy a no-log VPN for $5/month? If it's malicious activity behind VPNs in foreign countries, then see previous comment about blocking foreign countries. Block foreign countries at the interconnect until they enact and enforce laws which address the malicious activity. If it's malicious activity behind VPNs in your own country then you need only convince your law enforcement to enforce existing computer crime laws. Renting a server for $5/mo requires payment and payment provides a name & address to prosecute. All you need is to demonstrate that the malicious activity originated from the rented IP address and during the rental period.

whywhywhywhy 2y ago

On the one hand it makes spam more difficult on the other hand it makes breaking into someones most personal accounts way more simple, just have to convince the phone carrier customer support and then you get into the Apple account and all their other passwords.

dathinab 2y ago

> cost money yes, but it's surprisingly cheap (if you now where to ask for it and your operation is large enough) could have changed a bit after FTC started pushing a bit more against robocalls and for caller verification idk. a year ago??

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]