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Of those who didn't vote, why would they choose to vote next time? None of this is a surprise. It's not even like 2016, where people could say "I figured he'd

Of those who didn't vote, why would they choose to vote next time? None of this is a surprise. It's not even like 2016, where people could say "I figured he'd be less bad than he said he would be" with a straight face. Whatever excuse they found to not vote for the Democrat in 2024, will still apply in 2026 and 2028. Or they'll find a new one. And turnout in midterms is even worse than in Presidential years. I don't see those non-voters suddenly taking an interest then. It would be fantastic if somebody learned some lessons. But I think 2024 proves pretty definitively that people don't learn lessons.

JumpCrisscross 2y ago
> Of those who didn't vote, why would they choose to vote next time? My recollection is that non-voters tend to be reliably lazy, but I can’t find a good source. The system almost relies on it. If you can identify a non-voting bloc, in primaries or ideally even generals, you can tax them to give goodies to citizens.
- tombert 2y ago
  It's especially frustrating because it's always a self-righteous and sanctimonious rationalization to why they never vote. It's maddening, they complain about Trump, and when I mention that they didn't vote they say "YOU THINK KAMALA WOULD BE BETTER??? YOU THINK YOU'RE GOING TO FIX THIS PROBLEM BY VOTING LOL!!". And of course, they never define what "the problem" is, so there's actually no way to solve it, so they never have to actually vote.
  - jfengel 2y ago
    In my experience they can usually cite something that they don't like about the candidate. In the case of Harris I often heard her position on Gaza given. And they'll always find something, since we're talking about an office with life and death on the line.
    - tombert 2y ago
      I'm not sure I was a huge fan of Harris's take on Gaza either, but I didn't think for a second that Trump would be better than her on it either. I guess it's just a mentality I don't really understand.
      - lesuorac 2y ago
        Well, not that I like the mentality but it's a hardline one. By not voting for Harris and making her lose it means next cycle people have to care about your opinion to get elected. It's the opposite of when Progressives don't like a Democrat's proposal but still vote for it; it means the Democrats don't have to negotiate with them because they're getting the vote anyways.
        tombert 2y ago
        Sure, I guess what frustrates me is that they're effectively saying that having Trump is office than having another Democrat, because of some abstract "long game" that they think will happen. It's honestly pretty fucking dismissive of people who are affected by Trump's regressive policies. "It sucks that you got deported but maybe in fifteen years you'll thank me because we will have a proper progressive in office to fix problems that are really important but apparently impossible for us to actually enumerate with any kind of consistency".
        JumpCrisscross 2y ago
        > It's honestly pretty fucking dismissive of people who are affected by Trump's regressive policies Like the Gazans! The American Palestinian movement has been 100% about the protesters themselves. Not the Palestinians. The Defund the Police and Chesa crowd found a new cause to ruin. Folks who have never been to both countries confidently redrawing borders on another continent, the new Sykes and Picot.
        JumpCrisscross 2y ago
        > By not voting for Harris and making her lose it means next cycle people have to care about your opinion to get elected No? It makes you electorally irrelevant. Possibly toxic. Trump has carte blanche with Gaza because it’s not an issue any senior Democrat is willing to fight for after the Palestine vote proved both mercurial and unreliable. Hell, I’m experiencing some schadenfreude with the whole thing. The way to play it is to bloc vote in primaries and then reliably turn out in generals. See: the NRA.

JumpCrisscross 2y ago

> Of those who didn't vote, why would they choose to vote next time? My recollection is that non-voters tend to be reliably lazy, but I can’t find a good source. The system almost relies on it. If you can identify a non-voting bloc, in primaries or ideally even generals, you can tax them to give goodies to citizens.

tombert 2y ago
It's especially frustrating because it's always a self-righteous and sanctimonious rationalization to why they never vote. It's maddening, they complain about Trump, and when I mention that they didn't vote they say "YOU THINK KAMALA WOULD BE BETTER??? YOU THINK YOU'RE GOING TO FIX THIS PROBLEM BY VOTING LOL!!". And of course, they never define what "the problem" is, so there's actually no way to solve it, so they never have to actually vote.
- jfengel 2y ago
  In my experience they can usually cite something that they don't like about the candidate. In the case of Harris I often heard her position on Gaza given. And they'll always find something, since we're talking about an office with life and death on the line.
  - tombert 2y ago
    I'm not sure I was a huge fan of Harris's take on Gaza either, but I didn't think for a second that Trump would be better than her on it either. I guess it's just a mentality I don't really understand.
    - lesuorac 2y ago
      Well, not that I like the mentality but it's a hardline one. By not voting for Harris and making her lose it means next cycle people have to care about your opinion to get elected. It's the opposite of when Progressives don't like a Democrat's proposal but still vote for it; it means the Democrats don't have to negotiate with them because they're getting the vote anyways.
      - tombert 2y ago
        Sure, I guess what frustrates me is that they're effectively saying that having Trump is office than having another Democrat, because of some abstract "long game" that they think will happen. It's honestly pretty fucking dismissive of people who are affected by Trump's regressive policies. "It sucks that you got deported but maybe in fifteen years you'll thank me because we will have a proper progressive in office to fix problems that are really important but apparently impossible for us to actually enumerate with any kind of consistency".
        JumpCrisscross 2y ago
        > It's honestly pretty fucking dismissive of people who are affected by Trump's regressive policies Like the Gazans! The American Palestinian movement has been 100% about the protesters themselves. Not the Palestinians. The Defund the Police and Chesa crowd found a new cause to ruin. Folks who have never been to both countries confidently redrawing borders on another continent, the new Sykes and Picot.
      - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
        > By not voting for Harris and making her lose it means next cycle people have to care about your opinion to get elected No? It makes you electorally irrelevant. Possibly toxic. Trump has carte blanche with Gaza because it’s not an issue any senior Democrat is willing to fight for after the Palestine vote proved both mercurial and unreliable. Hell, I’m experiencing some schadenfreude with the whole thing. The way to play it is to bloc vote in primaries and then reliably turn out in generals. See: the NRA.