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> It is probably not a coincidence that George Orwell set his novel in the country that he's from. I think you might be onto something there! Not so much that

> It is probably not a coincidence that George Orwell set his novel in the country that he's from. I think you might be onto something there! Not so much that it just happened to be where he was from but more that he saw issues in the government of the day, some of which still persist since they seem to be cultural. > When I Google, pretty much every instance of the police interviewing people about transphobic tweets (that aren't actually hate speech) occurred before the court judgment I linked to. What you're saying in effect is that you want to go with the vibes about the UK you get from Twitter but don't want to look into the specifics and check their basis in fact. I'm aware of several incidents happening after the DM article linked which was six years ago. I'm not particularly motivated to find incidents and link them here because I think you're in a mode to dismiss anything found to try and defend against the notion the UK is less free than it's peers. I apologize for not being able to take you at your word that that isn't the case. > then I won't respond further. I appreciate that, and think that's for the best for both of us. Cheers.

foldr 2y ago
Even if you don't want to have an evidence-based discussion with me, I hope that you will check more carefully before making sweeping claims about the UK on HN in future.
- kennysoona 2y ago
  I'm confident in the claims I've made, not feeling like it's worth the work to convince you personally is quite a different thing.
  - hnlmorg 2y ago
    Not being funny, but you’re the one being closed minded here. The other commenter has cited evidence that’s backed up their claims and you’re consistently responding with rhetoric. This is a constant theme when people argue about freedom of speech being worse in the UK. They cherry pick a couple of headlines from hugely unreliable sources like Twitter (the land of vocal twits) and the Daily Mail (which most people here have nicknamed The Daily Fail because it’s so often wrong) and overlook what’s actually happening in their own countries too. But if it makes you feel better that your own country isn’t also going to hell in a hand-basket because you’re too busy doomscrolling the UK news, then keep at it. ;)
    - kennysoona 2y ago
      > The other commenter has cited evidence that’s backed up their claims and you’re consistently responding with rhetoric. Not the way I see it. I'm not willing to cite every single instance of a trend so a commenter can pick apart each one to try and dismiss it, when the problem is the trend itself, and not specific instances. That user also wants to try and pretend that the issue magically stopped after the local police were apparently counseled on the matter, and yet, hark!- another instance less than 4 months old![0] > This is a constant theme when people argue about freedom of speech being worse in the UK. I think the bigger issue is tribalism and feeling the need to defend country (and thus tribe) instead of acknowledging hey, maybe there really is a problem? > They cherry pick a couple of headlines from hugely unreliable sources like Twitter (the land of vocal twits) and the Daily Mail (which most people here have nicknamed The Daily Fail because it’s so often wrong) and I'm well aware of the reliability of the DM, but when they are just posting basically an interview with someone, it's sufficient as a source. Unless you want to dispute anything factual in the DM article that was linked? > overlook what’s actually happening in their own countries too. I think this is mostly a whataboutism. > But if it makes you feel better that your own country isn’t also going to hell in a hand-basket because you’re too busy doomscrolling the UK news, then keep at it. ;) I'm deeply concerned with what is happening in many countries, but that doesn't mean I can't be more concerned and critical of a country that is doing more wrong in some contexts than others. [0]https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/11/16/tweets-free-speech-gender-ideology-transphobia-police/ https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/11/16/tweets-free-spee...
      - foldr 2y ago
        That’s a 2024 article about an incident that happened in 2019. You can see the date mentioned in this non-paywalled write up: https://freespeechunion.org/i-too-had-visit-from-police-over-tweet-says-writer/ https://freespeechunion.org/i-too-had-visit-from-police-over... This is why it’s important to show sources so that (understandable) mistakes like this can be pointed out. If you keep posting sources that have been misinterpreted or that lack important context (which again is understandable - I don’t expect people outside the UK to obsessively follow UK news) then we can’t really take your word for it that you’ve Googled and found lots of better examples.

foldr 2y ago

Even if you don't want to have an evidence-based discussion with me, I hope that you will check more carefully before making sweeping claims about the UK on HN in future.

kennysoona 2y ago
I'm confident in the claims I've made, not feeling like it's worth the work to convince you personally is quite a different thing.
- hnlmorg 2y ago
  Not being funny, but you’re the one being closed minded here. The other commenter has cited evidence that’s backed up their claims and you’re consistently responding with rhetoric. This is a constant theme when people argue about freedom of speech being worse in the UK. They cherry pick a couple of headlines from hugely unreliable sources like Twitter (the land of vocal twits) and the Daily Mail (which most people here have nicknamed The Daily Fail because it’s so often wrong) and overlook what’s actually happening in their own countries too. But if it makes you feel better that your own country isn’t also going to hell in a hand-basket because you’re too busy doomscrolling the UK news, then keep at it. ;)
  - kennysoona 2y ago
    > The other commenter has cited evidence that’s backed up their claims and you’re consistently responding with rhetoric. Not the way I see it. I'm not willing to cite every single instance of a trend so a commenter can pick apart each one to try and dismiss it, when the problem is the trend itself, and not specific instances. That user also wants to try and pretend that the issue magically stopped after the local police were apparently counseled on the matter, and yet, hark!- another instance less than 4 months old![0] > This is a constant theme when people argue about freedom of speech being worse in the UK. I think the bigger issue is tribalism and feeling the need to defend country (and thus tribe) instead of acknowledging hey, maybe there really is a problem? > They cherry pick a couple of headlines from hugely unreliable sources like Twitter (the land of vocal twits) and the Daily Mail (which most people here have nicknamed The Daily Fail because it’s so often wrong) and I'm well aware of the reliability of the DM, but when they are just posting basically an interview with someone, it's sufficient as a source. Unless you want to dispute anything factual in the DM article that was linked? > overlook what’s actually happening in their own countries too. I think this is mostly a whataboutism. > But if it makes you feel better that your own country isn’t also going to hell in a hand-basket because you’re too busy doomscrolling the UK news, then keep at it. ;) I'm deeply concerned with what is happening in many countries, but that doesn't mean I can't be more concerned and critical of a country that is doing more wrong in some contexts than others. [0]https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/11/16/tweets-free-speech-gender-ideology-transphobia-police/ https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/11/16/tweets-free-spee...
    - foldr 2y ago
      That’s a 2024 article about an incident that happened in 2019. You can see the date mentioned in this non-paywalled write up: https://freespeechunion.org/i-too-had-visit-from-police-over-tweet-says-writer/ https://freespeechunion.org/i-too-had-visit-from-police-over... This is why it’s important to show sources so that (understandable) mistakes like this can be pointed out. If you keep posting sources that have been misinterpreted or that lack important context (which again is understandable - I don’t expect people outside the UK to obsessively follow UK news) then we can’t really take your word for it that you’ve Googled and found lots of better examples.