4 ms·

Because a right wing forum is actively drive hate against Asahi folks (specifically Marcan), and it's using orphaned/unmoderated threads (because the anchor pos

Because a right wing forum is actively drive hate against Asahi folks (specifically Marcan), and it's using orphaned/unmoderated threads (because the anchor post is flagged) on HN to post that hate and get search ranking for it. Example: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35237006 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35237006 HN should stop making those threads available, not because right wing, or left wing, or whatever political argument you'd like to make, but because it's a way to get search juice for lots of things for free that is also detrimental, ultimately, to HN. You can post any garbage you like outside the view of the community, and still get it associated with the community here.

gedy 2y ago
Maybe I'm missing some context, but how is some comment calling him weird related to right wing forums and needs the entire thread removed?
- alt187 2y ago
  Because that same line of questioning (Marcan being Lina) has been entertained by said right-wing forum, ergo this should be purged to avoid giving them "juice".
  - groby_b 2y ago
    That's not at all what I'm saying. This specific case involves a specific group of people. I'd be equally annoyed if people on the other side of the spectrum used what amounts to a bug in HN to influence search ranking for a smear campaign. HN makes flagged posts and subthreads invisible to its average users (you need to link to the subthread), but keeps them fully searchable. And does not moderate them. As a result, it's an easy way to deposit unreviewed content on a high-reputation website, leeching of that reputation. It's got nothing to do with politics, and everything with the fact that when you allow a community to be publicly associated with content without letting the community see or moderate the content, you're damaging the community's reputation. HN should fix the bug. That's all. Everybody involved in this particular drama is entirely entitled to say whatever the heck they want, just not under the cover of being pretend-part of this community.
    - alt187 2y ago
      But the only reason that makes you think that they belong to said right-wing forum is because they entertain this talking point, and their dislike of Marcan. It sounds quite cyclical. They dislike Marcan because they're alt-right users leeching off this community's reputation, which is obvious because they dislike Marcan. The people on the link you sent, they, uh, have a long comment history. No one is being "pretend-part" of the community here. Or am I missing some context?
  - anonfordays 2y ago
    Marcan is Lina. It's no longer something to be questioned. https://x.com/LunaFoxgirlVT/status/1887896920732876819 https://x.com/LunaFoxgirlVT/status/1887896920732876819 > It's the worst kept secret in history that I had to keep alive, I have no interest in keeping it alive anymore. > I mean, Lina started as an april fools joke on Marcan's youtube channel https://x.com/LunaFoxgirlVT/status/1887897472527458689 https://x.com/LunaFoxgirlVT/status/1887897472527458689 > So yes, Marcan is Asahi Lina, Asahi Lina is Marcan. It's not a secret, it never really was. > Only really became one when Marcan found out he liked vtubing. And if you don't like Twitter, Luna is also saying it on Bluesky: https://bsky.app/profile/lunafoxgirlvt.foxgirls.gay/post/3lh https://bsky.app/profile/lunafoxgirlvt.foxgirls.gay/post/3lh... > My abuser (asahi lina/marcan) is a Linux kernel contributor.
adastra22 2y ago
Why is it HN's problem that search engines suck?
- oneplane 2y ago
  Because HN has a reputation and this influences that reputation. The same way an open relay would harm your MTA reputation or an open redirect harms your domain reputation. So if HN were to think: "gee, we don't want to delete this content, but we also see how it breaks the rules", they could opt to put some noindex flags for the robots to consume which is a very cheap way to try to do something that reflects their own rules. It is of course possible that this is no reputation effect at all, and there is also no interest on a human level in all of this. In such a case, nothing happens.
  - adastra22 2y ago
    It seems to be smearing HN’s reputation. They don’t even point out any examples of this supposed behavior. They just link to something entirely unrelated.
    - oneplane 2y ago
      To me it seems to perfectly outline HN's reputation when moderation is delayed. This brigading has been happening on multiple projects for years, specifically by the actors mentioned in the link, but plenty of others as well. If anything, this specific behaviour and these actors have been outlined by articles dedicated to just that, right here on this sited. Granted, other sites are often lumped in here as well, such as reddit and even stackoverflow. This is not new behaviour, it happens in all communities. The big differences between them all is to what degree they get abused and in what manner. As for examples: I doubt people who are targeted will want to share their experience with anyone directly. Someone asking for it to stop should be enough.
      - adastra22 2y ago
        It is entirely reasonable to ask for an example. Even a single example will do. I’m not the only one who has never seen this before.
racked 2y ago
Just read KF's post about Hector and while it is frivolous (a lot of "who cares" moments), it is also founded with plenty of evidence. Simple freedom of speech, not hate speech. Also, I would never have read it if it wasn't for this thread. :-)

gedy 2y ago

Maybe I'm missing some context, but how is some comment calling him weird related to right wing forums and needs the entire thread removed?

alt187 2y ago
Because that same line of questioning (Marcan being Lina) has been entertained by said right-wing forum, ergo this should be purged to avoid giving them "juice".
- groby_b 2y ago
  That's not at all what I'm saying. This specific case involves a specific group of people. I'd be equally annoyed if people on the other side of the spectrum used what amounts to a bug in HN to influence search ranking for a smear campaign. HN makes flagged posts and subthreads invisible to its average users (you need to link to the subthread), but keeps them fully searchable. And does not moderate them. As a result, it's an easy way to deposit unreviewed content on a high-reputation website, leeching of that reputation. It's got nothing to do with politics, and everything with the fact that when you allow a community to be publicly associated with content without letting the community see or moderate the content, you're damaging the community's reputation. HN should fix the bug. That's all. Everybody involved in this particular drama is entirely entitled to say whatever the heck they want, just not under the cover of being pretend-part of this community.
  - alt187 2y ago
    But the only reason that makes you think that they belong to said right-wing forum is because they entertain this talking point, and their dislike of Marcan. It sounds quite cyclical. They dislike Marcan because they're alt-right users leeching off this community's reputation, which is obvious because they dislike Marcan. The people on the link you sent, they, uh, have a long comment history. No one is being "pretend-part" of the community here. Or am I missing some context?
- anonfordays 2y ago
  Marcan is Lina. It's no longer something to be questioned. https://x.com/LunaFoxgirlVT/status/1887896920732876819 https://x.com/LunaFoxgirlVT/status/1887896920732876819 > It's the worst kept secret in history that I had to keep alive, I have no interest in keeping it alive anymore. > I mean, Lina started as an april fools joke on Marcan's youtube channel https://x.com/LunaFoxgirlVT/status/1887897472527458689 https://x.com/LunaFoxgirlVT/status/1887897472527458689 > So yes, Marcan is Asahi Lina, Asahi Lina is Marcan. It's not a secret, it never really was. > Only really became one when Marcan found out he liked vtubing. And if you don't like Twitter, Luna is also saying it on Bluesky: https://bsky.app/profile/lunafoxgirlvt.foxgirls.gay/post/3lh https://bsky.app/profile/lunafoxgirlvt.foxgirls.gay/post/3lh... > My abuser (asahi lina/marcan) is a Linux kernel contributor.

adastra22 2y ago

Why is it HN's problem that search engines suck?

oneplane 2y ago
Because HN has a reputation and this influences that reputation. The same way an open relay would harm your MTA reputation or an open redirect harms your domain reputation. So if HN were to think: "gee, we don't want to delete this content, but we also see how it breaks the rules", they could opt to put some noindex flags for the robots to consume which is a very cheap way to try to do something that reflects their own rules. It is of course possible that this is no reputation effect at all, and there is also no interest on a human level in all of this. In such a case, nothing happens.
- adastra22 2y ago
  It seems to be smearing HN’s reputation. They don’t even point out any examples of this supposed behavior. They just link to something entirely unrelated.
  - oneplane 2y ago
    To me it seems to perfectly outline HN's reputation when moderation is delayed. This brigading has been happening on multiple projects for years, specifically by the actors mentioned in the link, but plenty of others as well. If anything, this specific behaviour and these actors have been outlined by articles dedicated to just that, right here on this sited. Granted, other sites are often lumped in here as well, such as reddit and even stackoverflow. This is not new behaviour, it happens in all communities. The big differences between them all is to what degree they get abused and in what manner. As for examples: I doubt people who are targeted will want to share their experience with anyone directly. Someone asking for it to stop should be enough.
    - adastra22 2y ago
      It is entirely reasonable to ask for an example. Even a single example will do. I’m not the only one who has never seen this before.

racked 2y ago

Just read KF's post about Hector and while it is frivolous (a lot of "who cares" moments), it is also founded with plenty of evidence. Simple freedom of speech, not hate speech. Also, I would never have read it if it wasn't for this thread. :-)