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Question for everyone - I've long wondered if it would be possible to use WASM to create a p2p "cloud" to reduce reliance on datacenters? My thought would be t

Question for everyone - I've long wondered if it would be possible to use WASM to create a p2p "cloud" to reduce reliance on datacenters? My thought would be to encrypt all data packets prior to shuffling them into the network, and have some sort of incentive for people to keep their devices running on the network to enhance reliability - probably with a blockchain of sorts that serves as the main "map" of content in the network. The dream goal would be to create a digital "data cooperative" that enables opt-in selling of your data/usage habits, with a default setting of total privacy. Ideally this would be backed by the blockchain to close the loop on the incentive for usage. Is there already something like this that I'm not aware of? Are there any areas of research I should look into?

pipo234 2y ago
You mean like BOINC? But with crypto?
concerndc1tizen 2y ago
You can't trust third party compute.
- JFingleton 2y ago
  Perhaps we could: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homomorphic_encryption https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homomorphic_encryption Someone far smarter than me could probably tell us if this actually works in the real world?
  - concerndc1tizen 2y ago
    Maybe, but are you saying that you could perform an operation like "if string startswith("www") then ..." without decryption? That sounds enormously complicated. And even so, it would be leaky, because you could follow the execution path and deduce things about the data. So in summary it sounds implausible, but I may be wrong.
bhelx 2y ago
yes it's certainly possible. i don't know if it exists but there are many things like it. not exactly what you describe, but many blockchains use wasm as the contract execution runtime. also, it kind of sounds like filecoin but with compute. i'm sure "protocol labs" has a project close to what you are talking about. edit: the hard part to note is probably the "trust" part. might be trickier to solve than just giving incentives.
- digdugdirk 2y ago
  Thanks for putting me on to Protocol Labs! It's a wealth of super cool projects.
  - turizzmo 2y ago
    Protocol Labs here — are you familiar with Fluence or Bacalhau projects? Those might be good starting points.
    - digdugdirk 2y ago
      Thank you! So glad you responded, Fluence seems to be very much along the lines of what I'm thinking. Is there a good entry point to understanding the project that you can recommend? The website is drenched in crypto-speak, and I'm very much outside of that community. Just looking for an overview/white paper to be able to get my bearings before digging deeper.
ImHereToVote 2y ago
You would need Middle-out compression for this to scale. Lepton from Dropbox uses Middle-out to compress jpg images.
nanomonkey 2y ago
I believe this is what the Spritely Institute (https://spritely.institute/ https://spritely.institute/) is working on with Spritely Goblins (distributed computing using object capabilities) and Hoot (Scheme to wasm compiler).
beeflet 2y ago
The new freenet has some interesting ideas related to this in the form of "contracts" and "delegates", which are essentially distributed WASM programs with their own memory. It sounds a lot like what you're describing: https://docs.freenet.org/components/contracts.html https://docs.freenet.org/components/contracts.html
nilslice 2y ago
pretty sure https://taubyte.com https://taubyte.com does just this

pipo234 2y ago

You mean like BOINC? But with crypto?

concerndc1tizen 2y ago

You can't trust third party compute.

JFingleton 2y ago
Perhaps we could: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homomorphic_encryption https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homomorphic_encryption Someone far smarter than me could probably tell us if this actually works in the real world?
- concerndc1tizen 2y ago
  Maybe, but are you saying that you could perform an operation like "if string startswith("www") then ..." without decryption? That sounds enormously complicated. And even so, it would be leaky, because you could follow the execution path and deduce things about the data. So in summary it sounds implausible, but I may be wrong.

bhelx 2y ago

yes it's certainly possible. i don't know if it exists but there are many things like it. not exactly what you describe, but many blockchains use wasm as the contract execution runtime. also, it kind of sounds like filecoin but with compute. i'm sure "protocol labs" has a project close to what you are talking about. edit: the hard part to note is probably the "trust" part. might be trickier to solve than just giving incentives.

digdugdirk 2y ago
Thanks for putting me on to Protocol Labs! It's a wealth of super cool projects.
- turizzmo 2y ago
  Protocol Labs here — are you familiar with Fluence or Bacalhau projects? Those might be good starting points.
  - digdugdirk 2y ago
    Thank you! So glad you responded, Fluence seems to be very much along the lines of what I'm thinking. Is there a good entry point to understanding the project that you can recommend? The website is drenched in crypto-speak, and I'm very much outside of that community. Just looking for an overview/white paper to be able to get my bearings before digging deeper.

ImHereToVote 2y ago

You would need Middle-out compression for this to scale. Lepton from Dropbox uses Middle-out to compress jpg images.

nanomonkey 2y ago

I believe this is what the Spritely Institute (https://spritely.institute/ https://spritely.institute/) is working on with Spritely Goblins (distributed computing using object capabilities) and Hoot (Scheme to wasm compiler).

beeflet 2y ago

The new freenet has some interesting ideas related to this in the form of "contracts" and "delegates", which are essentially distributed WASM programs with their own memory. It sounds a lot like what you're describing: https://docs.freenet.org/components/contracts.html https://docs.freenet.org/components/contracts.html

nilslice 2y ago

pretty sure https://taubyte.com https://taubyte.com does just this