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Drama needs to be worked against, not expanded upon. A lot of what I’m reading seems to make me feel that drama was… not avoided by this person, putting it cha

Drama needs to be worked against, not expanded upon. A lot of what I’m reading seems to make me feel that drama was… not avoided by this person, putting it charitably. And I'm someone who I believe still sponsors them! Asahi Linux is an awesome, and dare I say necessary, project. There is value in learning how to relinquish a constant "defensive posture" mentally. (I have struggled with, and am still working through this, personally, btw.) Heading a project like this surely challenges everyone's stoicism, though.

busterarm 2y ago
Agreed. There's such a victim mentality throughout this post. While it's clear that marcan faced into headwinds, they're also definitely not somebody that I want to be around me in any kind of leadership position.
- ChocolateGod 2y ago
  If you're trying to convince people to do things, certainly don't shit talk them on social media (even if you think it's true).
- Den_VR 2y ago
  Can’t say I’d want you on the team characterizing a situation like this, and communicating about a situation like this, as “victim mentality.” There’s a lot of toxic behaviors that have wormed their way into certain parts of culture. I’m not as concerned about bright, brash men like Hector.
  - busterarm 2y ago
    You're not concerned about somebody who incites the internet hate mob against you when they don't get their way in a technical/leadership disagreement? The amount of drama that this has created for Linux when the entire situation was being handled in a non-dramatic way is staggering. At its root, nothing about the entire situation had anything to do with marcan anyway and yet somehow he has focused an enormous amount of attention on himself and negative opinions at those he disagreed with. He habitually does things that draw attention to himself (in situations that aren't about him specifically) and then points to _any_ form of criticism he receives and cries harassment. Of course anyone reasonable would never want to work with him.
    - zoogeny 2y ago
      > nothing about the entire situation had anything to do with marcan anyway I agree with you but just a point of clarification. Martin was working on drivers that he wrote in Rust for the Asahi Linux project. Those drivers would utilize the rust API wrappers that were the subject of this debacle. If they were to be included (as he wanted) it would have made his life easier. If they were rejected then his own driver would be made more complicated. So, he had a legitimate stake in this and when he suspected it wasn't going the way he wanted he lashed out. The irony is, if he hadn't blown this all up, the change could very well have snuck in under the radar.
  - pixelesque 2y ago
    lol - you're not concerned about having people who threaten to create a "hall of shame" for kernel developers??! Jesus, I wouldn't want to work with either of you...
purplesyringa 2y ago
Avoiding drama is a two-way street. I'm not saying marcan wasn't at least somewhat at fault here, but the reason the drama happened in the first place is a leadership crisis and Linux folks calling Rust a cancerous religion without any pushback. Might be valuable to resolve these problems instead of blaming a scapegoat, don't you think?
- busterarm 2y ago
  marcan wasn't even involved directly in the leadership crisis and made himself the martyr/scapegoat. That's the entire problem. He threw a shitfit after the situation was already being handled (not ideally, but handled), got the slightest bit of pushback from Linus and then threw all of his toys away but with high publicity.

busterarm 2y ago

Agreed. There's such a victim mentality throughout this post. While it's clear that marcan faced into headwinds, they're also definitely not somebody that I want to be around me in any kind of leadership position.

ChocolateGod 2y ago
If you're trying to convince people to do things, certainly don't shit talk them on social media (even if you think it's true).
Den_VR 2y ago
Can’t say I’d want you on the team characterizing a situation like this, and communicating about a situation like this, as “victim mentality.” There’s a lot of toxic behaviors that have wormed their way into certain parts of culture. I’m not as concerned about bright, brash men like Hector.
- busterarm 2y ago
  You're not concerned about somebody who incites the internet hate mob against you when they don't get their way in a technical/leadership disagreement? The amount of drama that this has created for Linux when the entire situation was being handled in a non-dramatic way is staggering. At its root, nothing about the entire situation had anything to do with marcan anyway and yet somehow he has focused an enormous amount of attention on himself and negative opinions at those he disagreed with. He habitually does things that draw attention to himself (in situations that aren't about him specifically) and then points to _any_ form of criticism he receives and cries harassment. Of course anyone reasonable would never want to work with him.
  - zoogeny 2y ago
    > nothing about the entire situation had anything to do with marcan anyway I agree with you but just a point of clarification. Martin was working on drivers that he wrote in Rust for the Asahi Linux project. Those drivers would utilize the rust API wrappers that were the subject of this debacle. If they were to be included (as he wanted) it would have made his life easier. If they were rejected then his own driver would be made more complicated. So, he had a legitimate stake in this and when he suspected it wasn't going the way he wanted he lashed out. The irony is, if he hadn't blown this all up, the change could very well have snuck in under the radar.
- pixelesque 2y ago
  lol - you're not concerned about having people who threaten to create a "hall of shame" for kernel developers??! Jesus, I wouldn't want to work with either of you...

purplesyringa 2y ago

Avoiding drama is a two-way street. I'm not saying marcan wasn't at least somewhat at fault here, but the reason the drama happened in the first place is a leadership crisis and Linux folks calling Rust a cancerous religion without any pushback. Might be valuable to resolve these problems instead of blaming a scapegoat, don't you think?

busterarm 2y ago
marcan wasn't even involved directly in the leadership crisis and made himself the martyr/scapegoat. That's the entire problem. He threw a shitfit after the situation was already being handled (not ideally, but handled), got the slightest bit of pushback from Linus and then threw all of his toys away but with high publicity.