5 ms·

50% savings seems very optimistic. If you drill all your holes, switch once, then drive all your screws, there's only a few seconds this thing can possibly save

50% savings seems very optimistic. If you drill all your holes, switch once, then drive all your screws, there's only a few seconds this thing can possibly save you. Then you consider that it takes a smidge more effort to drill with this sub-optimal bit, and it's really a stretch. There would have to be some aspect of the project's assembly sequence that required you to switch multiple times.

hunter-gatherer 2y ago
I've done a decent amount of remodel work and new builds. The workflow you've described rarely plays out in real jobs. This combo bit looks particularly useful for building things like decks.
- mvdtnz 2y ago
  Would you use Philips head screws for a deck? I wouldn't. Even square drive is a pain if you need to back them out for any reason - you're sure to round out one in 20 or 30 of them, then RIP to any time you saved. I pretty much exclusively moved to star drive.
  - throwup238 2y ago
    Is there any reason the design can’t be adapted to a star drive? Is there not enough clearance between the points on the bit or not enough room for clearance with the extra drill flutes? Is it too flat on the head compared to phillips?
    - doubleg72 2y ago
      This design hardly works with Philips..
  - rpcope1 2y ago
    I can't believe people use anything other than Torx or something equivalent, especially for outside work. The difference between crappy regular wood screws and a box of GRK or Deckmate is night and day.
  - _blk 2y ago
    I used to think of Torx as the best until I met a French Canadian who dared me to use Robertson (square).. I did, now I'm all Robertson. The screws stick to the bit before putting them in and always come loose after. Torx acrews often sticks to the bit when they're in. I also seem to need less of a variety of sizes compared to Torx. But hey, I'll take Torx over Philipps any day.. Not sure why those are still around.
    - mvdtnz 2y ago
      Robertson is much more prone to camming out, especially when trying to remove them after they have been in place for a while and a little gunk builds up in the square.
      - drekipus 2y ago
        Is that not the case with torx? I could suppose not. I've been using Robertson but I don't often build stuff.. yet..
        lolc 2y ago
        For star drive, the force is transferred between the walls of the bit and the walls of the screw flush against each other. Like with gears. This leads to minimal wear and allows for wide tolerances and sloppy angles between bit and screw. Square bits on the other hand drive the edge of the bit against the wall of the square hole. The edge can cut a circle into the screw, and the square head gets turned into a circle by wear. Thus required tolerances are much lower, and screws don't fall off the bit. If they did fall off you'd know to change the worn bit.
- ok_dad 2y ago
  Why not use deck screws designed to self drill? They work fine for boards you’d use on a deck. This driver/drill bit is strictly worse than the alternatives. Most homeowners doing any building other than drilling a few holes for photo hanging will probably have bought a drill/driver pair from Ryobi or something anyways, so you don’t really need to swap bits.
_mlbt 2y ago
Not only that, but most people who do a lot of woodworking have both a drill and an impact driver that they switch between as necessary.
- Rury 2y ago
  I bet it doesn't drill as nice as a normal drill bit, especially for certain materials.
  - Doxin 2y ago
    It doesn't have a brad-point, worse the face of it is flat. I don't see how this drill doesn't wander terribly when trying to get it started.
Nevermark 2y ago
> 50% savings seems very optimistic. If you drill all your holes, switch once, then drive all your screws, there's only a few seconds this thing can possibly save you. A few seconds is often the difference between doing something and not. Obviously not talking about work. But if I have a drill, already with a drill/screw bit in it, and box of right sized screws it is going to get used anywhere a screw can make any difference at all. People say "If all you have is a hammer, ..." For a reason! Nobody says, "If all you have is a drill, a box of drill bits, a set of drawers with screws, ...". For a reason! (It would be great if every decent sized box of screws came with a drill/screw bit appropriately sized for pre-drill and screw. As a hobby level crafter, who cannot always find things, those would be the boxes of screws I bought every time. Every other box of screws would become invisible to me.)
- aaronbrethorst 2y ago
  https://spax.us/ https://spax.us/
- spenczar5 2y ago
  > It would be great if every decent sized box of screws came with a drill/screw bit appropriately sized for pre-drill and screw This is very common. GRK, Spax, Axis (a local brand to the Seattle area), and many more. Yes, they are better!
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
defrost 2y ago
To be honest people that do handy work regularly and value the time savings have two, three and even four drills. I've got a rural, agricultural, mining and aviation background and since the 1970s we've worked singlely or in pairs with multiple drills, one to drill holes, another to drive screws. If there's a big cupboard or similar on the bench it's not unknown to have seperate drills for * thin pilot hole, * main larger diameter hole, * larger again counter sink hole for top of shaft to hide screw head, * driver to put screws in.
- forgetfreeman 2y ago
  Absolutely this. It starts by intentionally buying a drill, then getting lured by one of those tool combo deals that has another drill lurking in the pile. Then someone hears you like working with your hands and you're absolutely getting a drill for <insert gift giving occasion here>. The first time you don't have to stop and chuck a new bit mid-task you'll wonder why the hell you ever worked any other way.
  - xvokcarts 2y ago
    >then getting lured by one of those tool combo deals that has another drill lurking in the pile So relatable it's funny. Yeah, you described my experience exactly! :)
    - forgetfreeman 2y ago
      Have you made it to the end stage where you decide that software, the software industry, developer culture, etc. is fractally bullshit and started a home repair and remodeling company?
      - xvokcarts 2y ago
        Almost. Bought shitload of pro tools, found an apartment to remodel completely by myself (and completed it), but stopped at the final step: haven't started a remodeling company :D
turtlebits 2y ago
Apparently you've never had to change drill bits up high on a ladder? I've dropped (and lost) plenty of drill bits trying to undo the chuck whilst holding a screwdriver bit. It may have its uses if this can free up a hand.
- taberiand 2y ago
  I'd consider using a small magnet taped to the drill. Though I usually just use my pocket
  - mkarliner 2y ago
    At last! A useful comment on HN! Great idea!
    - willhslade 2y ago
      You can also buy a magnetic bracelet.
  - is_true 2y ago
    That could work. I use a little tray that fits in the steps/top of the ladder
- jdietrich 2y ago
  Round shank drill bits and three-jaw chucks are largely obsolete for job site use. Contractors are now predominantly using hex shank drill bits in an impact driver for conventional drilling, or SDS drill bits for masonry drilling. https://www.lowes.com/pl/power-tool-accessories/drill-bits/twist-drill-bits/hex-shank/4294607742-4294777760 https://www.lowes.com/pl/power-tool-accessories/drill-bits/t...
  - zettabomb 2y ago
    >Round shank drill bits and three-jaw chucks are largely obsolete for job site use. Not sure if I agree here. Of course SDS has been the standard for quite a while in masonry uses, but impacts simply do not have the power of a full sized drill with a 1/2" chuck (or bigger) for more difficult materials. The 1/4" hex shank is pretty limiting for torque as well, and the chuck has far worse concentricity if you care at all about precision. The hex shank bits are decent (although I'd say I prefer round shank with flats) but calling round shank obsolete seems a bit far.
ansgri 2y ago
The biggest time saving I've had in woodworking was switching to modern self-drilling screws with Torx head [1]. With a highish-rpm impact driver, these screws require no pre-drilling even with plywood and are a pleasure to work with in general. [1] https://domax.com/en/model/cs https://domax.com/en/model/cs
m463 2y ago
I will say that changing bits is hard... - under a foundation - on a ladder - <insert favorite example here>

hunter-gatherer 2y ago

I've done a decent amount of remodel work and new builds. The workflow you've described rarely plays out in real jobs. This combo bit looks particularly useful for building things like decks.

mvdtnz 2y ago
Would you use Philips head screws for a deck? I wouldn't. Even square drive is a pain if you need to back them out for any reason - you're sure to round out one in 20 or 30 of them, then RIP to any time you saved. I pretty much exclusively moved to star drive.
- throwup238 2y ago
  Is there any reason the design can’t be adapted to a star drive? Is there not enough clearance between the points on the bit or not enough room for clearance with the extra drill flutes? Is it too flat on the head compared to phillips?
  - doubleg72 2y ago
    This design hardly works with Philips..
- rpcope1 2y ago
  I can't believe people use anything other than Torx or something equivalent, especially for outside work. The difference between crappy regular wood screws and a box of GRK or Deckmate is night and day.
- _blk 2y ago
  I used to think of Torx as the best until I met a French Canadian who dared me to use Robertson (square).. I did, now I'm all Robertson. The screws stick to the bit before putting them in and always come loose after. Torx acrews often sticks to the bit when they're in. I also seem to need less of a variety of sizes compared to Torx. But hey, I'll take Torx over Philipps any day.. Not sure why those are still around.
  - mvdtnz 2y ago
    Robertson is much more prone to camming out, especially when trying to remove them after they have been in place for a while and a little gunk builds up in the square.
    - drekipus 2y ago
      Is that not the case with torx? I could suppose not. I've been using Robertson but I don't often build stuff.. yet..
      - lolc 2y ago
        For star drive, the force is transferred between the walls of the bit and the walls of the screw flush against each other. Like with gears. This leads to minimal wear and allows for wide tolerances and sloppy angles between bit and screw. Square bits on the other hand drive the edge of the bit against the wall of the square hole. The edge can cut a circle into the screw, and the square head gets turned into a circle by wear. Thus required tolerances are much lower, and screws don't fall off the bit. If they did fall off you'd know to change the worn bit.
ok_dad 2y ago
Why not use deck screws designed to self drill? They work fine for boards you’d use on a deck. This driver/drill bit is strictly worse than the alternatives. Most homeowners doing any building other than drilling a few holes for photo hanging will probably have bought a drill/driver pair from Ryobi or something anyways, so you don’t really need to swap bits.

_mlbt 2y ago

Not only that, but most people who do a lot of woodworking have both a drill and an impact driver that they switch between as necessary.

Rury 2y ago
I bet it doesn't drill as nice as a normal drill bit, especially for certain materials.
- Doxin 2y ago
  It doesn't have a brad-point, worse the face of it is flat. I don't see how this drill doesn't wander terribly when trying to get it started.

Nevermark 2y ago

> 50% savings seems very optimistic. If you drill all your holes, switch once, then drive all your screws, there's only a few seconds this thing can possibly save you. A few seconds is often the difference between doing something and not. Obviously not talking about work. But if I have a drill, already with a drill/screw bit in it, and box of right sized screws it is going to get used anywhere a screw can make any difference at all. People say "If all you have is a hammer, ..." For a reason! Nobody says, "If all you have is a drill, a box of drill bits, a set of drawers with screws, ...". For a reason! (It would be great if every decent sized box of screws came with a drill/screw bit appropriately sized for pre-drill and screw. As a hobby level crafter, who cannot always find things, those would be the boxes of screws I bought every time. Every other box of screws would become invisible to me.)

aaronbrethorst 2y ago
https://spax.us/ https://spax.us/
spenczar5 2y ago
> It would be great if every decent sized box of screws came with a drill/screw bit appropriately sized for pre-drill and screw This is very common. GRK, Spax, Axis (a local brand to the Seattle area), and many more. Yes, they are better!

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]

defrost 2y ago

To be honest people that do handy work regularly and value the time savings have two, three and even four drills. I've got a rural, agricultural, mining and aviation background and since the 1970s we've worked singlely or in pairs with multiple drills, one to drill holes, another to drive screws. If there's a big cupboard or similar on the bench it's not unknown to have seperate drills for * thin pilot hole, * main larger diameter hole, * larger again counter sink hole for top of shaft to hide screw head, * driver to put screws in.

forgetfreeman 2y ago
Absolutely this. It starts by intentionally buying a drill, then getting lured by one of those tool combo deals that has another drill lurking in the pile. Then someone hears you like working with your hands and you're absolutely getting a drill for <insert gift giving occasion here>. The first time you don't have to stop and chuck a new bit mid-task you'll wonder why the hell you ever worked any other way.
- xvokcarts 2y ago
  >then getting lured by one of those tool combo deals that has another drill lurking in the pile So relatable it's funny. Yeah, you described my experience exactly! :)
  - forgetfreeman 2y ago
    Have you made it to the end stage where you decide that software, the software industry, developer culture, etc. is fractally bullshit and started a home repair and remodeling company?
    - xvokcarts 2y ago
      Almost. Bought shitload of pro tools, found an apartment to remodel completely by myself (and completed it), but stopped at the final step: haven't started a remodeling company :D

turtlebits 2y ago

Apparently you've never had to change drill bits up high on a ladder? I've dropped (and lost) plenty of drill bits trying to undo the chuck whilst holding a screwdriver bit. It may have its uses if this can free up a hand.

taberiand 2y ago
I'd consider using a small magnet taped to the drill. Though I usually just use my pocket
- mkarliner 2y ago
  At last! A useful comment on HN! Great idea!
  - willhslade 2y ago
    You can also buy a magnetic bracelet.
- is_true 2y ago
  That could work. I use a little tray that fits in the steps/top of the ladder
jdietrich 2y ago
Round shank drill bits and three-jaw chucks are largely obsolete for job site use. Contractors are now predominantly using hex shank drill bits in an impact driver for conventional drilling, or SDS drill bits for masonry drilling. https://www.lowes.com/pl/power-tool-accessories/drill-bits/twist-drill-bits/hex-shank/4294607742-4294777760 https://www.lowes.com/pl/power-tool-accessories/drill-bits/t...
- zettabomb 2y ago
  >Round shank drill bits and three-jaw chucks are largely obsolete for job site use. Not sure if I agree here. Of course SDS has been the standard for quite a while in masonry uses, but impacts simply do not have the power of a full sized drill with a 1/2" chuck (or bigger) for more difficult materials. The 1/4" hex shank is pretty limiting for torque as well, and the chuck has far worse concentricity if you care at all about precision. The hex shank bits are decent (although I'd say I prefer round shank with flats) but calling round shank obsolete seems a bit far.

ansgri 2y ago

The biggest time saving I've had in woodworking was switching to modern self-drilling screws with Torx head [1]. With a highish-rpm impact driver, these screws require no pre-drilling even with plywood and are a pleasure to work with in general. [1] https://domax.com/en/model/cs https://domax.com/en/model/cs

m463 2y ago

I will say that changing bits is hard... - under a foundation - on a ladder - <insert favorite example here>