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One thing I would go miles and miles to avoid - having it break down during use, releasing god knows what into my food. Acidity breaks it down? What if some ke

by jajko 2y ago

One thing I would go miles and miles to avoid - having it break down during use, releasing god knows what into my food. Acidity breaks it down? What if some ketchup in bun or some other acidic part of food is wrapped with it? In 2 hours when you unpack you look at holes in that plastic wondering if you will eat that material (of course you will). Had enough BPAs and PFOAs scare to not trust novel chemical crap from companies that have no issue poisoning half the planet for profit and having real food safety only as an annoying afterthought.

nicoburns 2y ago
Indeed. I'm not a big fan of Teflon. But at least it's almost completely inert (unless overheated), which makes it much less likely to be harmful than substitutes.
- Someone 2y ago
  > But at least it's almost completely inert (unless overheated), which makes it much less likely to be harmful than substitutes. I don’t think that’s a strong argument. Asbestos is quite inert, and that is what makes it so harmful. A fiber will, over time, harm more and more cells.
  - lazide 2y ago
    Teflon isn’t a sub-cellular sized needle though.
- PaulHoule 2y ago
  Probably breaks down to shorter chain PFAS https://chemsec.org/the-teflon-chemical-ptfe-is-often-touted-as-a-safe-cousin-of-toxic-pfas-but-is-it-really/ https://chemsec.org/the-teflon-chemical-ptfe-is-often-touted... Although it is claimed that very little migrates to food https://www.fda.gov/food/process-contaminants-food/authorized-uses-pfas-food-contact-applications https://www.fda.gov/food/process-contaminants-food/authorize... The monomer used to make it is considered "probably carcinogenic" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tetrafluoroethylene#Safety https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tetrafluoroethylene#Safety so occupational exposure at the factory and environmental release are concerns.
  - nicoburns 2y ago
    > The monomer used to make it is considered "probably carcinogenic" Yeah, this is what I heard before. That the coating itself isn't so bad, but the manufacturing process produces stuff that is awful enough that we probably shouldn't use it.
- autoexec 2y ago
  "overheated" seems to be doing a lot of work here. It's extremely easy to heat a teflon coated pan to the point where it becomes harmful. Teflon flu isn't good for humans and is absolutely fatal to birds. Non-stick cookware releases toxic gases at typical cooking temperatures. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28913736/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28913736/
metalman 2y ago
yup, acidity breaking plastic down is a big no no, for ANY human contact or use in a engineered structural component. the latest "eco plastic" offering fits into the same category as the latest battery tech, wonder food, la la la, foofoo berries. Some of these things WILL pan out eventualy, but the evaluation needs to be cold blooded, and explicit based on access to real test data and real world third party evaluation. Till then it's quasi organic energy enhancing foo foo berry powder, though the expectation is that we all abase ourselves before the deployment of the magic word, sustainability.

by jajko 2y ago

nicoburns 2y ago

Indeed. I'm not a big fan of Teflon. But at least it's almost completely inert (unless overheated), which makes it much less likely to be harmful than substitutes.

Someone 2y ago
> But at least it's almost completely inert (unless overheated), which makes it much less likely to be harmful than substitutes. I don’t think that’s a strong argument. Asbestos is quite inert, and that is what makes it so harmful. A fiber will, over time, harm more and more cells.
- lazide 2y ago
  Teflon isn’t a sub-cellular sized needle though.
PaulHoule 2y ago
Probably breaks down to shorter chain PFAS https://chemsec.org/the-teflon-chemical-ptfe-is-often-touted-as-a-safe-cousin-of-toxic-pfas-but-is-it-really/ https://chemsec.org/the-teflon-chemical-ptfe-is-often-touted... Although it is claimed that very little migrates to food https://www.fda.gov/food/process-contaminants-food/authorized-uses-pfas-food-contact-applications https://www.fda.gov/food/process-contaminants-food/authorize... The monomer used to make it is considered "probably carcinogenic" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tetrafluoroethylene#Safety https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tetrafluoroethylene#Safety so occupational exposure at the factory and environmental release are concerns.
- nicoburns 2y ago
  > The monomer used to make it is considered "probably carcinogenic" Yeah, this is what I heard before. That the coating itself isn't so bad, but the manufacturing process produces stuff that is awful enough that we probably shouldn't use it.
autoexec 2y ago
"overheated" seems to be doing a lot of work here. It's extremely easy to heat a teflon coated pan to the point where it becomes harmful. Teflon flu isn't good for humans and is absolutely fatal to birds. Non-stick cookware releases toxic gases at typical cooking temperatures. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28913736/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28913736/

metalman 2y ago

yup, acidity breaking plastic down is a big no no, for ANY human contact or use in a engineered structural component. the latest "eco plastic" offering fits into the same category as the latest battery tech, wonder food, la la la, foofoo berries. Some of these things WILL pan out eventualy, but the evaluation needs to be cold blooded, and explicit based on access to real test data and real world third party evaluation. Till then it's quasi organic energy enhancing foo foo berry powder, though the expectation is that we all abase ourselves before the deployment of the magic word, sustainability.