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My father is a retired mechanical engineer. About 10 or 12 years back he mentored some engineering students on their senior project. He said they were very smar

My father is a retired mechanical engineer. About 10 or 12 years back he mentored some engineering students on their senior project. He said they were very smart, but had almost never touched a machine before which both frustrated and baffled him. In his day, engineers learned how to make the kinds of parts they designed because a design is a set of instructions to factory workers on how to make the part. If you knew nothing about tooling, tolerances, etc. you couldn't produce adequate designs, and the most valuable information came from actually working with the machines.

mitthrowaway2 2y ago
It's probably not their fault. A lot of university engineering programs don't provide students with access to machine shops.
- blitzar 2y ago
  A lot of university engineering departments don't have machine shops.
- bitwize 2y ago
  He was more frustrated with how the state of education had changed than with the students themselves. He actually enjoyed working with them.
xyzzy123 2y ago
In 2025 making pancakes at school requires a written risk assessment / safety plan. Health and safety regulation has exploded in the last 40 years and the liability gives administrators heart attacks. Many kids today are not even allowed to use kitchen knives let alone chisels or lathes. It's not the fault of the kids, but the effects are somewhat self-fulfilling - kids who don't get access to even slightly dangerous things while growing up don't develop the skills and awareness they need to work safely as young adults.
jcgrillo 2y ago
I believe the same problem is present in software. The same things that make "physical" tools good are what make computer tools good. If you don't have any experience using physical tools, you won't be easily able to appreciate what using a good tool feels like. I think a lot of the problems in software--buggy, inefficient, over complicated, user hostile crap that most of it is--can be traced back to a misunderstanding of the concept of "creativity" or "innovation" rooted in simply not knowing where the guard rails are.

mitthrowaway2 2y ago

It's probably not their fault. A lot of university engineering programs don't provide students with access to machine shops.

blitzar 2y ago
A lot of university engineering departments don't have machine shops.
bitwize 2y ago
He was more frustrated with how the state of education had changed than with the students themselves. He actually enjoyed working with them.

xyzzy123 2y ago

In 2025 making pancakes at school requires a written risk assessment / safety plan. Health and safety regulation has exploded in the last 40 years and the liability gives administrators heart attacks. Many kids today are not even allowed to use kitchen knives let alone chisels or lathes. It's not the fault of the kids, but the effects are somewhat self-fulfilling - kids who don't get access to even slightly dangerous things while growing up don't develop the skills and awareness they need to work safely as young adults.

jcgrillo 2y ago

I believe the same problem is present in software. The same things that make "physical" tools good are what make computer tools good. If you don't have any experience using physical tools, you won't be easily able to appreciate what using a good tool feels like. I think a lot of the problems in software--buggy, inefficient, over complicated, user hostile crap that most of it is--can be traced back to a misunderstanding of the concept of "creativity" or "innovation" rooted in simply not knowing where the guard rails are.