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From my perspective it seems like HN abandoned the mandate of intellectually curious stories and conversations and is instead a place where only non-controversi

From my perspective it seems like HN abandoned the mandate of intellectually curious stories and conversations and is instead a place where only non-controversial stories and conversations are encouraged. If people can only talk about things where no one can vociferously disagree then we aren't really being inquisitive and curious, merely eccentric. Your comment of "discussion here is marginally* more substantive" footnoted that it's not particularly good also seems a bit condescending. Its dismissive to those attempting to engage with these stories in good faith even if a vocal minority are behaving in bad faith. When a dozen stories are popping up and disappearing in a few hours it feels a lot harder to participate in a thoughtful and substantial ways. I can understand HN is in a rough spot. But on the other hand, the only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good people to do nothing.

dang 2y ago
> a place where only non-controversial stories and conversations are encouraged I've made a list of 23 threads (see the reply below), all from the last month. There are over 13k comments in those threads alone, and it's not a complete list. It's interesting how claims like "only non-controversial stories" or "no discussion of this sort shall be allowed" (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42976817 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42976817) arise during periods when there's a sharp increase in such threads (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42978572 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42978572). At first that seems counterintuitive (like Jevons' paradox, or Yogi Berra's "nobody goes there anymore, it's too crowded"). But it's not so paradoxical. These aren't factual propositions, they're expressions of a feeling—what people are really saying is not that there is no coverage of these topics, but that they would like more coverage. They often use words like "no", "zero", "never", and "nothing" to express how they feel, but what they mean by these words is "not enough". Which is fair enough. The community always splits between users who want more and users who feel like it's too much. Also, it's easy to miss any particular thread or sequence of threads. Even among regular HN readers, there will be many who haven't seen even one of the 23 threads listed below, or who only saw 1 or 2, and therefore might naturally feel like none of this is being discussed. Among those, there will be some who feel strongly about it, and some of these will naturally express their feeling in the way I described above. Nonetheless, in reality there is a large amount of this discussion happening—it is by far the most-discussed topic of recent weeks, and will likely continue to be. > also seems a bit condescending Sorry for giving that impression! I often add a disclaimer like that because I don't want to sound like I'm making excessive claims about HN's discussion quality. The most I can say is that median discussion quality here is modestly better than elsewhere on the internet, but at its worst it's still pretty bad. I don't mean to put down HN commenters who are using the site thoughtfully. You have to remember that as moderators we see a lot of stuff like https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43018472 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43018472, to pick the most recent example. In fact we must see more of that than any other reader, simply because it's our job to.
- dang 2y ago
  Musk-led group makes $97B bid for control of OpenAI - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43004889 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43004889 - Feb 2025 (937 comments) Teen on Musk's DOGE team graduated from 'The Com' - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42981756 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42981756 - Feb 2025 (1768 comments) Announcing the data.gov archive - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42970039 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42970039 - Feb 2025 (127 comments) Elon Musk's Demolition Crew - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42968430 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42968430 - Feb 2025 (348 comments) DOGE staffer resigns over racist posts - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42966412 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42966412 - Feb 2025 (105 comments) DOGE employees ordered to stop using Slack - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42951458 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42951458 - Feb 2025 (373 comments) 20k federal workers take "buyout" so far, official says - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42950790 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42950790 - Feb 2025 (547 comments) What's happening inside the NIH and NSF - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42940257 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42940257 - Feb 2025 (1519 comments) Onlookers freak out as 25-year-old set loose on Treasury computer system - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42936421 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42936421 - Feb 2025 (133 comments) Payments crisis of 2025: Not “read only” access anymore - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42933219 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42933219 - Feb 2025 (654 comments) Words flagged in search of current NSF awards - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42932760 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42932760 - Feb 2025 (154 comments) The young, inexperienced engineers aiding DOGE - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42910910 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42910910 - Feb 2025 (2978 comments) CDC: Unpublished manuscripts mentioning certain topics must be pulled or revised - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42905937 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42905937 - Feb 2025 (719 comments) Phyllis Fong, who was investigating Neuralink, "forcefully removed " - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42902355 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42902355 - Feb 2025 (214 comments) CDC data are disappearing - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42897696 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42897696 - Feb 2025 (589 comments) The government information crisis is bigger than you think it is - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42895331 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42895331 - Feb 2025 (270 comments) NSF starts vetting all grants to comply with executive orders - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42886661 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42886661 - Jan 2025 (488 comments) Archivists work to save disappearing data.gov datasets - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42881367 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42881367 - Jan 2025 (238 comments) Trump's Federal Funding Freeze and Mean-Field Game Theory - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42863339 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42863339 - Jan 2025 (89 comments) Deferred resignation email to federal employees - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42859552 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42859552 - Jan 2025 (151 comments) 'Never seen anything like this' – NIH meetings and travel halted abruptly - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42817910 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42817910 - Jan 2025 (111 comments) NIH hit with freezes on meetings, travel, communications, and hiring - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42798960 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42798960 - Jan 2025 (440 comments) United States Digital Service renamed to DOGE - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42775684 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42775684 - Jan 2025 (98 comments)

dang 2y ago

> a place where only non-controversial stories and conversations are encouraged I've made a list of 23 threads (see the reply below), all from the last month. There are over 13k comments in those threads alone, and it's not a complete list. It's interesting how claims like "only non-controversial stories" or "no discussion of this sort shall be allowed" (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42976817 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42976817) arise during periods when there's a sharp increase in such threads (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42978572 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42978572). At first that seems counterintuitive (like Jevons' paradox, or Yogi Berra's "nobody goes there anymore, it's too crowded"). But it's not so paradoxical. These aren't factual propositions, they're expressions of a feeling—what people are really saying is not that there is no coverage of these topics, but that they would like more coverage. They often use words like "no", "zero", "never", and "nothing" to express how they feel, but what they mean by these words is "not enough". Which is fair enough. The community always splits between users who want more and users who feel like it's too much. Also, it's easy to miss any particular thread or sequence of threads. Even among regular HN readers, there will be many who haven't seen even one of the 23 threads listed below, or who only saw 1 or 2, and therefore might naturally feel like none of this is being discussed. Among those, there will be some who feel strongly about it, and some of these will naturally express their feeling in the way I described above. Nonetheless, in reality there is a large amount of this discussion happening—it is by far the most-discussed topic of recent weeks, and will likely continue to be. > also seems a bit condescending Sorry for giving that impression! I often add a disclaimer like that because I don't want to sound like I'm making excessive claims about HN's discussion quality. The most I can say is that median discussion quality here is modestly better than elsewhere on the internet, but at its worst it's still pretty bad. I don't mean to put down HN commenters who are using the site thoughtfully. You have to remember that as moderators we see a lot of stuff like https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43018472 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43018472, to pick the most recent example. In fact we must see more of that than any other reader, simply because it's our job to.

dang 2y ago
Musk-led group makes $97B bid for control of OpenAI - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43004889 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43004889 - Feb 2025 (937 comments) Teen on Musk's DOGE team graduated from 'The Com' - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42981756 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42981756 - Feb 2025 (1768 comments) Announcing the data.gov archive - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42970039 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42970039 - Feb 2025 (127 comments) Elon Musk's Demolition Crew - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42968430 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42968430 - Feb 2025 (348 comments) DOGE staffer resigns over racist posts - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42966412 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42966412 - Feb 2025 (105 comments) DOGE employees ordered to stop using Slack - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42951458 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42951458 - Feb 2025 (373 comments) 20k federal workers take "buyout" so far, official says - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42950790 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42950790 - Feb 2025 (547 comments) What's happening inside the NIH and NSF - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42940257 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42940257 - Feb 2025 (1519 comments) Onlookers freak out as 25-year-old set loose on Treasury computer system - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42936421 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42936421 - Feb 2025 (133 comments) Payments crisis of 2025: Not “read only” access anymore - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42933219 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42933219 - Feb 2025 (654 comments) Words flagged in search of current NSF awards - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42932760 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42932760 - Feb 2025 (154 comments) The young, inexperienced engineers aiding DOGE - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42910910 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42910910 - Feb 2025 (2978 comments) CDC: Unpublished manuscripts mentioning certain topics must be pulled or revised - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42905937 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42905937 - Feb 2025 (719 comments) Phyllis Fong, who was investigating Neuralink, "forcefully removed " - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42902355 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42902355 - Feb 2025 (214 comments) CDC data are disappearing - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42897696 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42897696 - Feb 2025 (589 comments) The government information crisis is bigger than you think it is - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42895331 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42895331 - Feb 2025 (270 comments) NSF starts vetting all grants to comply with executive orders - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42886661 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42886661 - Jan 2025 (488 comments) Archivists work to save disappearing data.gov datasets - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42881367 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42881367 - Jan 2025 (238 comments) Trump's Federal Funding Freeze and Mean-Field Game Theory - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42863339 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42863339 - Jan 2025 (89 comments) Deferred resignation email to federal employees - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42859552 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42859552 - Jan 2025 (151 comments) 'Never seen anything like this' – NIH meetings and travel halted abruptly - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42817910 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42817910 - Jan 2025 (111 comments) NIH hit with freezes on meetings, travel, communications, and hiring - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42798960 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42798960 - Jan 2025 (440 comments) United States Digital Service renamed to DOGE - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42775684 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42775684 - Jan 2025 (98 comments)