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Shopify President Harley Finkelstein told CNBC’s “Squawk on the Street” Tuesday that the website’s owners “had an entire day” to prove they weren’t violating th

Shopify President Harley Finkelstein told CNBC’s “Squawk on the Street” Tuesday that the website’s owners “had an entire day” to prove they weren’t violating the company’s policies, “which did not happen.” ... “The moment we realized this was not actually a real commerce practice, they weren’t actually engaging in authentic commerce, we pulled it down,” Finkelstein said. Not "engaging in authentic commerce" sounds like it wasn't taken down because of the swastikas, but because the shirts weren't actually for sale?

muglug 2y ago
Much easier to get them on a standard technicality than to do anything to arouse the attention of the far-right.
- wyattshacker 2y ago
  Exactly.
beepbopboopp 2y ago
Using a company run by a Finkelstein to sell Swastika shirts is always a risky strategy Ye.
- bdndndndbve 2y ago
  He's totally fine with Nazis, although he will use his identity to deflect criticism.
ygjb 2y ago
Are you surprised? Shopify and Tobi Lütke have strongly defended "freedom of speech" to continue platforming hate groups in the past. They are happy to platform truly awful people as long as they get their cut.
- jeswin 2y ago
  Why should "freedom of speech" not be defended? The way to combat hate is by educating people better, instead of banning swastikas or whatever.
  - ygjb 2y ago
    Agree to disagree; first, I am not American, and don't buy into the notion of Freedom of Speech - I am Canadian, and we have Freedom of Expression, which includes the notion that while people should have freedom of expression, there are certain elements of expression that infringe on the safety of others, and it is reasonable to restrict them. I know the US has had similar constraints in the past (fire in a theatre, etc), but the US is also currently speed-running trying to throw it's history of oppression into the memory hole. It's not enough to just depend on educating people - we can see that education hasn't been very effective, and education has been subverted in several countries, including the United States and Canada.
    - ranger_danger 2y ago
      > to continue platforming hate groups in the past You say that as if there is some conscious decision to explicitly allow each and every instance of questionable speech like it's their job to police it. Do you consider Cloudflare agreeing with the speech on 4chan by allowing them to use their services? I take comfort in knowing that (many) companies understand they should not be the judge of what speech should be allowed, I see them merely as a conduit and not an arbiter. This is exactly why Section 230 exists in the US, it shields providers from what other people say or do when using their networks. And if we didn't have that, I think the Internet as it stands would be completely different. Not sure what good you thought it was going to do to come into a thread about a US company, say they are defending free speech and then turn around and go "yea I don't believe in free speech". I would die for their right to free speech even if I don't agree with what they say. Are you prepared to do the same for your beliefs?
      - ygjb 2y ago
bdndndndbve 2y ago
Shopify is absolutely fine with selling hate products as long as you give them their cut. If you're using them for free web hosting they draw the line. They probably also didn't splash out for the premium plan where you get a dedicated concierge.
takoid 2y ago
How would Shopify determine a store isn’t “engaging in authentic commerce” if the products aren’t set to ship for 6-8 weeks? That’s standard for Yeezy drops, and past releases have been delivered. Why is this suddenly an issue now? Seems more like a convenient excuse than the real reason for shutting it down.
- maccard 2y ago
  FTA: > Shopify President Harley Finkelstein told CNBC’s “Squawk on the Street” Tuesday that the website’s owners “had an entire day” to prove they weren’t violating the company’s policies, “which did not happen.”
  - takoid 2y ago
    I understand that they were given a day to prove they weren’t violating policies, but my point is that it seems pretty obvious Shopify is selectively enforcing its policies to shut down the store because they don’t like the shirt being sold. The policy is just a cover for the real reason.
    - maccard 2y ago
      I’m not arguing otherwise, but it wasn’t clear to me at all that that was your point.
- wyattshacker 2y ago
  Yeah. SHOP just doesn't wanna be pegged as being "too woke" under the current administration. All of tech is apparently scared of Trump, Musk, and their allies in SV and WS.
  - ygjb 2y ago
    Shopify has never been a woke company - Shopify and their leaders have a history of defending hosting hateful content under the guise of freedom of speech.
ranger_danger 2y ago
I thought it was impossible to prove a negative. What exactly would they have even accepted as this "proof" ?

muglug 2y ago

Much easier to get them on a standard technicality than to do anything to arouse the attention of the far-right.

wyattshacker 2y ago
Exactly.

beepbopboopp 2y ago

Using a company run by a Finkelstein to sell Swastika shirts is always a risky strategy Ye.

bdndndndbve 2y ago
He's totally fine with Nazis, although he will use his identity to deflect criticism.

ygjb 2y ago

Are you surprised? Shopify and Tobi Lütke have strongly defended "freedom of speech" to continue platforming hate groups in the past. They are happy to platform truly awful people as long as they get their cut.

jeswin 2y ago
Why should "freedom of speech" not be defended? The way to combat hate is by educating people better, instead of banning swastikas or whatever.
- ygjb 2y ago
  Agree to disagree; first, I am not American, and don't buy into the notion of Freedom of Speech - I am Canadian, and we have Freedom of Expression, which includes the notion that while people should have freedom of expression, there are certain elements of expression that infringe on the safety of others, and it is reasonable to restrict them. I know the US has had similar constraints in the past (fire in a theatre, etc), but the US is also currently speed-running trying to throw it's history of oppression into the memory hole. It's not enough to just depend on educating people - we can see that education hasn't been very effective, and education has been subverted in several countries, including the United States and Canada.
  - ranger_danger 2y ago
    > to continue platforming hate groups in the past You say that as if there is some conscious decision to explicitly allow each and every instance of questionable speech like it's their job to police it. Do you consider Cloudflare agreeing with the speech on 4chan by allowing them to use their services? I take comfort in knowing that (many) companies understand they should not be the judge of what speech should be allowed, I see them merely as a conduit and not an arbiter. This is exactly why Section 230 exists in the US, it shields providers from what other people say or do when using their networks. And if we didn't have that, I think the Internet as it stands would be completely different. Not sure what good you thought it was going to do to come into a thread about a US company, say they are defending free speech and then turn around and go "yea I don't believe in free speech". I would die for their right to free speech even if I don't agree with what they say. Are you prepared to do the same for your beliefs?
    - ygjb 2y ago

bdndndndbve 2y ago

Shopify is absolutely fine with selling hate products as long as you give them their cut. If you're using them for free web hosting they draw the line. They probably also didn't splash out for the premium plan where you get a dedicated concierge.

takoid 2y ago

How would Shopify determine a store isn’t “engaging in authentic commerce” if the products aren’t set to ship for 6-8 weeks? That’s standard for Yeezy drops, and past releases have been delivered. Why is this suddenly an issue now? Seems more like a convenient excuse than the real reason for shutting it down.

maccard 2y ago
FTA: > Shopify President Harley Finkelstein told CNBC’s “Squawk on the Street” Tuesday that the website’s owners “had an entire day” to prove they weren’t violating the company’s policies, “which did not happen.”
- takoid 2y ago
  I understand that they were given a day to prove they weren’t violating policies, but my point is that it seems pretty obvious Shopify is selectively enforcing its policies to shut down the store because they don’t like the shirt being sold. The policy is just a cover for the real reason.
  - maccard 2y ago
    I’m not arguing otherwise, but it wasn’t clear to me at all that that was your point.
wyattshacker 2y ago
Yeah. SHOP just doesn't wanna be pegged as being "too woke" under the current administration. All of tech is apparently scared of Trump, Musk, and their allies in SV and WS.
- ygjb 2y ago
  Shopify has never been a woke company - Shopify and their leaders have a history of defending hosting hateful content under the guise of freedom of speech.

ranger_danger 2y ago

I thought it was impossible to prove a negative. What exactly would they have even accepted as this "proof" ?