> Belief alone is worthless, you can believe something is true and in the face of objective truth know it is not. The thing that matters is whether reality show

> Belief alone is worthless, you can believe something is true and in the face of objective truth know it is not. The thing that matters is whether reality shows its true or not. Again, what "objective truth"? In the age of disinformation, objectivity doesn't exist. There are only subjective "truths", where whoever has the most influence and reach decides what reality is for everyone else. Belief is the only thing that matters at this time. > Unlike communism, and socialism, there is no decision from a central authority who the true citizens are. There's not much difference from late-stages of capitalism and any other system. Power is centralized, an oligarchy rises to the top, disinformation and censorship are rampant, etc. > It comes down to objective reality and whether your actions show conformance to the founding father's principles. I find it amusing that Americans fetishize their founding fathers so much. These were fallible humans who lived in an entirely different world from ours. The system you enjoy today required dozens of amendments, reforms and revolutions over hundreds of years, yet what some rich politicians thought in the 18th century is held in highest regard, for some reason. > Rational people can agree on objective truth because the truth is the truth, its based in objective measure, and regardless of what someone says it doesn't change the fact that X happened Please. The world went through an epidemic that killed millions. Do you know the objective truth about what caused it? Was there foreign election interference in the 2020 election? Were the January 6th riots an attempt to overthrow the government? Is Donald Trump guilty of any of the crimes he was charged with, or was it a "witch hunt", "fake news", etc.? Is Elon Musk a Nazi or did he just make an awkward gesture? Was Epstein suicided? Was Pizzagate accurate? How about QAnon? These examples are neverending. You can call people who believe in conspiracy theories delusional and "parasites", but the fact is everyone is susceptible to psychological manipulation, regardless of their political inclination or ideology. You're not above it all and don't get to claim what the objective truth is. This is what disinformation ultimately causes. > You are mistaken, the division today has not always existed I'm not well versed in US history, but I do know that the precursors for the Civil War accrued over decades during the first half of the 19th century. Perhaps even before that. So, yes, the division was there since arguably the inception, and it never went away. It was just supressed, with occasional outbursts over time, but always ready to be reignited. > That is a rigid pipe-dream where it will never come to pass its a pigeonhole for an impossible to solve problem. Luckily it doesn't need to be solved. I agree with the first sentence. Disagree with the second if you wish to preserve your current union. If not, then sure, it doesn't need to be solved. > It will be the same as any major empire's fall. I'm confused. You disagree with my claim that America is doomed, yet agree that the empire will fall in the near future. To save us both some time: we disagree on whether disinformation is a problem, and whether and how it should be solved. I don't think either of us will change our mind about this, but cheers for the chat.