4 ms·

> Good design is innovative Why? Maybe it's meant in an artistic sense, but under an engineering one I just don't see it.

scarface_74 2y ago
Artistic design leads you to the unnecessary skeuomorphism of iOS 1-6
- gamedever 2y ago
  that was vastly better than today's "guess which things are interactive" design where what's clickable/editable/interactable is just a guessing game.
  - wwweston 2y ago
    This. Stuff like stitched leather was obviously indulgent without a lot of function, but skeumorphic buttons at least carried a standard complement of affordances that too much flat design ignores.
idle_zealot 2y ago
If it's not innovative, then you're reinventing the wheel and would be better off using someone else's good design.
- cgh 2y ago
  From the article: "We are destroying software telling new programmers: “Don’t reinvent the wheel!”. But, reinventing the wheel is how you learn how things work, and is the first step to make new, different wheels."
  - idle_zealot 2y ago
    Reinventing the wheel is a great learning exercise, but it doesn't yeild great software.
    - 8n4vidtmkvmk 2y ago
      I dunno, I feel like I'm having to reinvent the wheel more often these days. I try a few existing libs but they're frequently bad or bloated, and rewriting it from scratch yields better results. I have to pick my battles though, can only do this with things which take no more than a couple days to write.
    - marginalia_nu 2y ago
      Eh, I disagree. Oftentimes integrating someone else's wheel comes with so much added complexity that it rivals (or exceeds) making your own, and that code also needs to be maintained, is at risk of library churn, etc. There are very real drawbacks to relying on other people's solutions to your problems. Sometimes they are outweighed by the hassle of implementing your own solution, but in many cases they do not.
    - philwelch 2y ago
      Taking a dependency on “left-pad”, on the other hand…
- mytailorisrich 2y ago
  Note that Dieter Rams is an industrial designer so his 10 principles are not about software but about 'design'. In that context a "good design" is indeed innovative in some way. But in engineering a "good design" does not have to be, and in many cases probably shouldn't be.
  - lucianbr 2y ago
    > > > Good design is innovative > > Why? > a "good design" is indeed innovative in some way Proof by repetition, I guess? You haven't answered the question in any meaningful way, just repeated the original assertion. It's still as unsupported as it ever was.
docmars 2y ago
I read "innovative" as coming up with a novel solution to a known problem. Sometimes the things we consider already solved can be solved better with nuances that maybe weren't considered before.

scarface_74 2y ago

Artistic design leads you to the unnecessary skeuomorphism of iOS 1-6

gamedever 2y ago
that was vastly better than today's "guess which things are interactive" design where what's clickable/editable/interactable is just a guessing game.
- wwweston 2y ago
  This. Stuff like stitched leather was obviously indulgent without a lot of function, but skeumorphic buttons at least carried a standard complement of affordances that too much flat design ignores.

idle_zealot 2y ago

If it's not innovative, then you're reinventing the wheel and would be better off using someone else's good design.

cgh 2y ago
From the article: "We are destroying software telling new programmers: “Don’t reinvent the wheel!”. But, reinventing the wheel is how you learn how things work, and is the first step to make new, different wheels."
- idle_zealot 2y ago
  Reinventing the wheel is a great learning exercise, but it doesn't yeild great software.
  - 8n4vidtmkvmk 2y ago
    I dunno, I feel like I'm having to reinvent the wheel more often these days. I try a few existing libs but they're frequently bad or bloated, and rewriting it from scratch yields better results. I have to pick my battles though, can only do this with things which take no more than a couple days to write.
  - marginalia_nu 2y ago
    Eh, I disagree. Oftentimes integrating someone else's wheel comes with so much added complexity that it rivals (or exceeds) making your own, and that code also needs to be maintained, is at risk of library churn, etc. There are very real drawbacks to relying on other people's solutions to your problems. Sometimes they are outweighed by the hassle of implementing your own solution, but in many cases they do not.
  - philwelch 2y ago
    Taking a dependency on “left-pad”, on the other hand…
mytailorisrich 2y ago
Note that Dieter Rams is an industrial designer so his 10 principles are not about software but about 'design'. In that context a "good design" is indeed innovative in some way. But in engineering a "good design" does not have to be, and in many cases probably shouldn't be.
- lucianbr 2y ago
  > > > Good design is innovative > > Why? > a "good design" is indeed innovative in some way Proof by repetition, I guess? You haven't answered the question in any meaningful way, just repeated the original assertion. It's still as unsupported as it ever was.

docmars 2y ago

I read "innovative" as coming up with a novel solution to a known problem. Sometimes the things we consider already solved can be solved better with nuances that maybe weren't considered before.