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Unpopular because it is undemocratic. The EU is a bureaucracy that works against democracy. Its goal is to steal more and more power from national governments t

Unpopular because it is undemocratic. The EU is a bureaucracy that works against democracy. Its goal is to steal more and more power from national governments that are run by elected representatives towards a bureaucracy that decides their next actions in Davos.

microtonal 2y ago
The European Parliament is directly elected by the citizens of the European Union. The European Council consists of government leaders of the EU countries, which are also chosen in most countries based on the results of elections. The only exception is the European Commission, which is chosen by indirect democracy (nominated by member countries, approved by the parliament, and they can dissolve the EC).
- coliveira 2y ago
  Yes, it is the European Commission that's the central problem.
  - microtonal 2y ago
    Why is the EC a problem? In many democracies the executive branch is instated and kept in check by a parliament. The EC are not always my picks and there is definitely a lot of politics involved, but I think it's an asset that people with some level of expertise are selected and that the executive branch is somewhat protected against making very short-term decisions because they have to think about their next election. People should stop bashing the EU. Like any democracy it has its issues, but it is hugely successful in avoiding war between countries that have been in war for centuries, plus the EU actually has a spine and has generally (with exceptions) protected people's privacy, protected people against large companies, etc. The primary weakness of the EU is that it cannot do enough yet (but every crisis makes leaders realize that working together at the EU-level is more successful than trying to operate as a single country).
  - jonp888 2y ago
    I've heard this often and I don't understand it at all. Every government in the world has a permanent set of employees which enact policy and turn political intentions into legislation. Usually these are split into departments, each headed by temporary political appointee. So exactly like the European Commission, then. Why is it only "undemocratic" when the European Union does it? Are you suggesting that all 32000 people working for it should be elected? I'm quite certain there is no government in the world which does that and it seems quite impractical. Or should every political appointment be directly elected, instead of appointed by a head of state? You could do that, but I am not aware of any major government which does so, so if that's the sole reason to call it "undemocratic" then it's a double standard.
    - coliveira 2y ago
      The EC desires to get more and more power over EU countries' policy, with the excuse of "doing its job". In a normal country, the executive branch is also elected by the population. In the EU, they get there by appointment, so they are an extra step removed from democracy. It is just the opposite of what you want to do to improve democracy. Instead of more opportunities for people to control government, you're creating an extra level of indirection that makes control even harder.

microtonal 2y ago

The European Parliament is directly elected by the citizens of the European Union. The European Council consists of government leaders of the EU countries, which are also chosen in most countries based on the results of elections. The only exception is the European Commission, which is chosen by indirect democracy (nominated by member countries, approved by the parliament, and they can dissolve the EC).

coliveira 2y ago
Yes, it is the European Commission that's the central problem.
- microtonal 2y ago
  Why is the EC a problem? In many democracies the executive branch is instated and kept in check by a parliament. The EC are not always my picks and there is definitely a lot of politics involved, but I think it's an asset that people with some level of expertise are selected and that the executive branch is somewhat protected against making very short-term decisions because they have to think about their next election. People should stop bashing the EU. Like any democracy it has its issues, but it is hugely successful in avoiding war between countries that have been in war for centuries, plus the EU actually has a spine and has generally (with exceptions) protected people's privacy, protected people against large companies, etc. The primary weakness of the EU is that it cannot do enough yet (but every crisis makes leaders realize that working together at the EU-level is more successful than trying to operate as a single country).
- jonp888 2y ago
  I've heard this often and I don't understand it at all. Every government in the world has a permanent set of employees which enact policy and turn political intentions into legislation. Usually these are split into departments, each headed by temporary political appointee. So exactly like the European Commission, then. Why is it only "undemocratic" when the European Union does it? Are you suggesting that all 32000 people working for it should be elected? I'm quite certain there is no government in the world which does that and it seems quite impractical. Or should every political appointment be directly elected, instead of appointed by a head of state? You could do that, but I am not aware of any major government which does so, so if that's the sole reason to call it "undemocratic" then it's a double standard.
  - coliveira 2y ago
    The EC desires to get more and more power over EU countries' policy, with the excuse of "doing its job". In a normal country, the executive branch is also elected by the population. In the EU, they get there by appointment, so they are an extra step removed from democracy. It is just the opposite of what you want to do to improve democracy. Instead of more opportunities for people to control government, you're creating an extra level of indirection that makes control even harder.