6 ms·

I still can't believe the 'skeuomorphic' interfaces for Calendar and Reminders made it into the final version of Mountain Lion. These apps are often in the cor

• Lewisham 14y ago
  This doesn't seem like it is going to change. Ever. The course Apple was on software-wise when Jobs passed away Apple seems terrified of moving away from, even when it was clear at the time that desktop was not getting full attention over iOS. No one in software at Apple seems to have the vision required to make positive changes, rather than cribbing from iOS as the Lions have. Jonny Ive can keep hardware running well, but software is languishing. It used to be such an easy choice as to what OS I wanted. Mac OS X was prettier, more stable, more fluid and had better apps. I think Windows 8 is a much prettier OS, although the apps aren't there yet. Ubuntu is also plenty usable, has the UNIX underpinnings, and is less ugly in a number of spots than OS X (god I hate linen, and I have no love for skuemorphism). I've strongly considered running Windows 8 as my host system and virtualizing Mountain Lion, although I'm leaning towards sticking to Mac as host for now. EDIT: FWIW, I would note that Apple's core programming: system libraries and such, remains top notch. It's the front-end that seems fairly clueless.
  • untog 14y ago
    I've been considering a fulltime move to Linux for a long time, but have yet to take the plunge- I tried a few years ago, but the driver support for my Macbook was less than great. Now, Lion seems to have slowed down my 2010 Macbook Air- at times it absolutely crawls when I'm positive it never used to. Is there anyone out there running Ubuntu full time who can say how good driver support is? In particular the trackpad- I've never had a perfect trackpad experience outside of OS X, Windows hasn't been able to do it either.
    • dr42 14y ago
      I don't think it's lion to blame, I too have the 2010 air with lion and it runs just fine. Maybe spend some time with ps and find what process is eating your CPU. I'm not using file vault, maybe that's adding some overhead. I would recommend upgrading the hardware though, the resale on the 2010 air is pretty good, so moving to a 2012 isn't going to cost you much. I tried Linux on mine and it was a real pain.
    • secoif 14y ago
      Are you running time machine? Time machine brings my SSD MBP to a crawl.
      • Lewisham 14y ago
        Yeah, SSD is completely negated when the file system has to wait for an external drive to spin up before it will be responsive, even if you're only using the local drive. Because there's no setting for automounting and unmounting a Time Machine drive, I ended up using my old Macbook Pro as a file server and plugging in the external to that, then using a hack to get Time Machine to recognize it as a Time Capsule. sigh
    • mitjak 14y ago
      Running Ubuntu with either Unity or vanilla Gnome 3 about 75% of the time on my MBP 13", after having switched to it from the increasingly ugly consumer-tailored, unstable Lion. Unfortunately, OS X still has a great lead in terms of input, particularly the trackpad. There are a few ways to make existence under Ubuntu more pleasant. Here is an article that helped me: http://uselessuseofcat.com/?p=74 http://uselessuseofcat.com/?p=74
    • acdha 14y ago
      > Now, Lion seems to have slowed down my 2010 Macbook Air- at times it absolutely crawls when I'm positive it never used to That's not Lion (same system, OS, identical performance to day 1). I'd fire up Activity Monitor and see what's active when it's slow - there's probably something causing a ton of background I/O.
• blackRust 14y ago
  I prefer bolder features in these applications, they are the ones in the corner and when your eyes look out for them the distinctive features help enormously. As a counter example take Google's redesign: I can't tell by a glance whether I am in Calendar, Email, Groups or Blogger. It is unified but without distinctiveness.
• shadesandcolour 14y ago
  My take on skeuomorphism has always been ambivalent. Unless the interface really takes away from your productivity, and having to click one or two extra buttons doesn't count, then it's alright by me. Anyone complaining about the visual aspect of it is really complaining to complain.
  • chucknelson 14y ago
    I agree - they look fine. Everyone needs to stop over-analyzing.
    • hnriot 14y ago
      Actually everyone needs to stay analyzing, that's how we make progress. The steam engine's fine, everyone needs to stop over analyzing.
      • hyperbovine 14y ago
        Did you really just compare the industrial revolution to the texture of a calendar app menu bar?
        • glhaynes 14y ago
          No, the original poster made an analogy. There's no equivalence being drawn nor value-comparison being made and it's very frustrating how often legitimate analogies are made and the conversation gets bogged down in "you said those are basically the same you must be crazy!" when no such thing happened.
          • hyperbovine 14y ago
            Interesting that you would accuse me of putting words in somebody's mouth by putting words in my mouth. It's a flawed analogy.
  • dr42 14y ago
    We're past the point where the operating system is just about productivity. Computers are used by everyone to do a vast number of things, people live their lives with their computers and how they look (the apps) is a part of that. You don't need a window in your office to improve your productivity, but it certainly makes life more livable when surrounded by well designed and beautiful things.
• danneu 14y ago
  I understand what's not to like about it, but I actually like that screenshot. Mostly because of the visual differentiation. There's a limit, of course. I saw a screenshot of Mountain Lion where Reminders was a yellow legal pad with scratchy red coloring-pencil markouts on finished reminders. That was harsh. But I find even the ugly examples are almost always superior to the days of uniform chrome like the Win2000 era: http://cdn.ttgtmedia.com/digitalguide/images/Misc/da_screen.jpg http://cdn.ttgtmedia.com/digitalguide/images/Misc/da_screen.... -- where you could squint your eyes and become unable to tell apart the programs on screen.
  • 89a 14y ago
    The yellow pad is the notes app and still there
• saint-loup 14y ago
  I loathe Calendar, but Reminders seems OK to me. The texture is quite subtle.
• pooriaazimi 14y ago
  > These apps are often in the corner of the screen while working with different applications; Maybe that's the rationale behind it in the first place? "It's so cluttered... Let's make these apps' looks really distinct so they really stand out..."
• maayank 14y ago
  I like it. I saw many blog posts and rants either way, but never concrete usability data saying it's bad. The Calendar and Reminders apps don't work a whole lot different than their non-virtual counterparts, minus the automatic notification. Borrowing the metaphor makes people more quickly familiarize themselves with the software (even if by feeling only, which is a plus).
• wmeredith 14y ago
  Well, as long as they basically keep printing money they'll continue this course. WE don't like the skeuomorphic stuff (no need for quotes, it's a real word) but the general public does. It demos well and makes software more approachable. It drives me nuts, but I'll bet it's here to stay. At least until the first video game generations are retirees.
  • saint-loup 14y ago
    >> the general public does Source? We don't have much data to measure the fondness of end users for skeuomorphic interfaces of the Mac OS sort. You mentionned some of the reasons to make UIs like that, and of course Apple is selling trunks of devices, but how do we know that users specifically like Calendars, Reminders, the Fullscreen mode of Photobooth, etc. ?
    • wmeredith 14y ago
      That's just my opinion. How about a quick appeal to authority - I've been deigning and shipping websites for 8 years and am the Online Marketing Manager at my web development agency. As a more serious attempt to back that opinion up I'd say look at the success of Apple's design in the marketplace over the last 10 years - pinning that exclusively on their love of skeuomorphism would be iffy, though.
    • eddieplan9 14y ago
      Since half of the people buying a Mac is new to Mac, it's safe to say many of them use an iDevice before they use a Mac. It makes sense to give them something familiar by copying some UI elements, especially for things like Calendar when the desktop experience does not need to be different from the mobile experience.
• 89a 14y ago
  You could have torn those tatty bits of paper off the thing before giving it to me Apple…
• saturdaysaint 14y ago
  I'm not a huge fan of brown leather, but Calendar's textures work together to draw my attention to the most relevant parts of the screen in a way that is almost entirely missing in Google Calendar, to pick on a prominent competitor. The leather is mildly ugly if I focus on it (never), but Google Calendar's harsh asymmetry, nonsensical color scheme (cartoonishly highlighting two buttons - "SEARCH" and "CREATE" - I never use), and inability to hide numerous unused elements bother me every second I have the tab open. I don't understand the value of these discussions about design that start and end with how skeutomorphic an application is. It's one of dozens of design elements, and it's disappointingly rare to find a well reasoned argument (not "I dunno, Windows 8 just feels cooler now") why skeutomorphism is categorically bad design.
  • Aloisius 14y ago
    The torn paper at the top of the Calendar app is torture to anyone with the slightest hint of OCD. I just need to tear off the bits that were left behind and I can't!
    • mitjak 14y ago
      Never mind that it's plain distracting visual clutter and serves no purpose whatsoever. Design for the sake of design.
      • saturdaysaint 14y ago
        Again, I consider this far less offensive and distracting than the undesign of, say, the garish red "Create" button and the garish blue "Search" buttons that pop right out of the Google Calendar interface. And you can actually have your calender occupy the center of the window in Calendar, which is aggravatingly impossible with Google. I'm not trying to point to an Apple/Google horserace, but seriously, there are other aspects to design then skeutomorphicness. Textures that appear as subtle gradients in your periphary are barely noticeable for most the vast majority of the population. I mean, just ask a non-geek iOS user what they think of the silk texture in iOS and prepare for a blank stare.