5 ms·

Those made nearly everyone uncomfortable in my experience and were the height of performative advocacy policy. But my experience comes from my time at a company

Those made nearly everyone uncomfortable in my experience and were the height of performative advocacy policy. But my experience comes from my time at a company that had a (soft) requirement to add those to our signature. I just don’t think a company needs to give much guidance at all on what goes in an email signature. I’m totally okay with anyone that includes pronouns on their own volition.

alistairSH 2y ago
Yes, for most people it was performative, but seriously, if being asked to call somebody by the gender they prefer makes you uncomfortable that's a you problem, not a them problem.
- readthenotes1 2y ago
  Being asked to accommodate anyone else's preferences is certainly a "me" problem. My preference is that people would understand that personal rights are social obligations and I think we would be better off to phrased it that way. And for goodness sake, stop using loudspeakers when you're walking the wilderness trails. I don't want to hear what you consider music
kcplate 2y ago
> Those made nearly everyone uncomfortable in my experience and were the height of performative advocacy policy. I won’t do it, but don’t care if others do in email signatures. I find it odd when it’s done in a meeting but I still won’t offer them up even if others are. I have been asked for mine a couple of times (and this irritates me…if you want me to respect that your pronouns are important to you, respect that “my” pronouns are unimportant to me). I respond with something akin to “your best guess will be fine with me”.
- Volundr 2y ago
  > respect that “my” pronouns are unimportant to me I can respect this if and only if it's actually true. If your going to be offended if someone uses a pronoun for the wrong gender, or uses "they" then I don't respect the performance, and in my experience most people who are resistant to giving their pronouns would indeed be offended by either of those. If you actually don't care, great, no problem. If you do I can't respect being unwilling to put in the miniscule effort to state your preference instead of being offended when someone doesn't default to it.
  - kcplate 2y ago
    > If you do I can't respect being unwilling to put in the miniscule effort to state your preference instead of being offended when someone doesn't default to it Before about 3ish years ago such a thing was never expected of me and I can’t think of a time prior or since where someone didn’t manage to correctly figure it from apparent social cues of their exposure to from me. Why all of a sudden should something that was a non-issue for decades would society now require me to spend a “miniscule of effort” or frankly any effort whatsoever to state something that should be completely obvious to you and has been by literally everyone who managed to encounter to me prior to now.
    - Volundr 2y ago
      In other words, you do care, and your whole "it's unimportant to me" and "your best guess is fine" isn't actually true. Instead, if you've chosen to play guessing games with someone who has made clear their intent to respect your preference, all the while pretending they're the ones who are being unreasonable. That I don't feel any need to respect.
      - kcplate 2y ago
        No, I am not playing the guessing game, they are. I am choosing to not play a game that didn’t exist 3 years ago because it’s unnecessary. This is literally a first world, English language only language fad. Y’all want to play it, have fun, I won’t get in your way. However let’s not pretend that you are somehow virtuous because you’re playing the game…but I am not because I am watching it amused on the sideline.
        pixxel 2y ago
        [dead]
        Volundr 2y ago
        You just claimed your pronouns are unimportant, and because of that your non-answer to an honest question should be respected, then turned around and said you would indeed be offended if someone used the wrong one. Sure sounds like playing games to me.

alistairSH 2y ago

Yes, for most people it was performative, but seriously, if being asked to call somebody by the gender they prefer makes you uncomfortable that's a you problem, not a them problem.

readthenotes1 2y ago
Being asked to accommodate anyone else's preferences is certainly a "me" problem. My preference is that people would understand that personal rights are social obligations and I think we would be better off to phrased it that way. And for goodness sake, stop using loudspeakers when you're walking the wilderness trails. I don't want to hear what you consider music

kcplate 2y ago

> Those made nearly everyone uncomfortable in my experience and were the height of performative advocacy policy. I won’t do it, but don’t care if others do in email signatures. I find it odd when it’s done in a meeting but I still won’t offer them up even if others are. I have been asked for mine a couple of times (and this irritates me…if you want me to respect that your pronouns are important to you, respect that “my” pronouns are unimportant to me). I respond with something akin to “your best guess will be fine with me”.

Volundr 2y ago
> respect that “my” pronouns are unimportant to me I can respect this if and only if it's actually true. If your going to be offended if someone uses a pronoun for the wrong gender, or uses "they" then I don't respect the performance, and in my experience most people who are resistant to giving their pronouns would indeed be offended by either of those. If you actually don't care, great, no problem. If you do I can't respect being unwilling to put in the miniscule effort to state your preference instead of being offended when someone doesn't default to it.
- kcplate 2y ago
  > If you do I can't respect being unwilling to put in the miniscule effort to state your preference instead of being offended when someone doesn't default to it Before about 3ish years ago such a thing was never expected of me and I can’t think of a time prior or since where someone didn’t manage to correctly figure it from apparent social cues of their exposure to from me. Why all of a sudden should something that was a non-issue for decades would society now require me to spend a “miniscule of effort” or frankly any effort whatsoever to state something that should be completely obvious to you and has been by literally everyone who managed to encounter to me prior to now.
  - Volundr 2y ago
    In other words, you do care, and your whole "it's unimportant to me" and "your best guess is fine" isn't actually true. Instead, if you've chosen to play guessing games with someone who has made clear their intent to respect your preference, all the while pretending they're the ones who are being unreasonable. That I don't feel any need to respect.
    - kcplate 2y ago
      No, I am not playing the guessing game, they are. I am choosing to not play a game that didn’t exist 3 years ago because it’s unnecessary. This is literally a first world, English language only language fad. Y’all want to play it, have fun, I won’t get in your way. However let’s not pretend that you are somehow virtuous because you’re playing the game…but I am not because I am watching it amused on the sideline.
      - pixxel 2y ago
        [dead]
      - Volundr 2y ago
        You just claimed your pronouns are unimportant, and because of that your non-answer to an honest question should be respected, then turned around and said you would indeed be offended if someone used the wrong one. Sure sounds like playing games to me.