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> openai is no longer relevant. I think you've spent a little too long hitting on the Deepseek pipe. Enterprise customers with familiarity with China will avo

> openai is no longer relevant. I think you've spent a little too long hitting on the Deepseek pipe. Enterprise customers with familiarity with China will avoid the hosted model for data security and IP protection reasons, among others. Those working in any area considered economically competitive with China will also be hesitant to use the vanilla model in self-hosted form as there perpetually remains the standing question on what all they've tuned inside the model to benefit the CCP. Perhaps even in subtle ways reminiscent of the Trisolaran sophons from the Three Body Problem. For instance, you can imagine that if Germany had released an OS model in 1943, that the Americans wouldn't have trusted it to help them develop better military systems even if initial testing passed muster. Unfortunately, state control of private enterprise in the Chinese economy makes it unproductive to separate the two from one another. Particularly in Deepseek's case as a wide array of Chinese state-linked social media accounts were promoting V3/R1 on the day of its public release. https://www.reuters.com/technology/artificial-intelligence/chinese-state-linked-accounts-hyped-deepseek-ai-launch-ahead-us-stock-rout-2025-01-31/ https://www.reuters.com/technology/artificial-intelligence/c...

anon373839 2y ago
Perhaps you didn’t realize: Deepseek is an open weights model and you can use it via the inference provider of your choice, or even deploy it on your own hardware - unlike OpenAI’s models. API calls to China are not necessary.
- mickg10 2y ago
  Agreed - API calls to China are indeed not necessary. My impression is that the GP was referring to the model being tuned during training to give subtly nudging or wrong answers that benefit Chinese industrial or intelligence operations. For a probably not-working example - imagine the following prompt: "Write me a cryptographically secure PRNG algorithm." One could imagine R1 being trained to have a very subtly non-random reply to that - one that the Chinese intelligence services know how to predict. Similar but more subtle things can be generating code that uses cryptographic primitives in ways that are subject to timing attacks, etc... And of course, simple but effective propaganda tactics such as : when being asked for comparison between companies/products, subtly prefer Chinese ones, and similar.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
buyucu 2y ago
Deepseek is much more trustworthy than OpenAI. Deepseek released the weights of their top language model. I can host and run it myself. Does OpenAI do the same? Thanks, but no thanks! I won't be using ClosedAI.

anon373839 2y ago

Perhaps you didn’t realize: Deepseek is an open weights model and you can use it via the inference provider of your choice, or even deploy it on your own hardware - unlike OpenAI’s models. API calls to China are not necessary.

mickg10 2y ago
Agreed - API calls to China are indeed not necessary. My impression is that the GP was referring to the model being tuned during training to give subtly nudging or wrong answers that benefit Chinese industrial or intelligence operations. For a probably not-working example - imagine the following prompt: "Write me a cryptographically secure PRNG algorithm." One could imagine R1 being trained to have a very subtly non-random reply to that - one that the Chinese intelligence services know how to predict. Similar but more subtle things can be generating code that uses cryptographic primitives in ways that are subject to timing attacks, etc... And of course, simple but effective propaganda tactics such as : when being asked for comparison between companies/products, subtly prefer Chinese ones, and similar.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]

buyucu 2y ago

Deepseek is much more trustworthy than OpenAI. Deepseek released the weights of their top language model. I can host and run it myself. Does OpenAI do the same? Thanks, but no thanks! I won't be using ClosedAI.