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This seems to be an real and important problem with capacitive touch screens. My elderly mother is often unable to make a touch register on recent Apple devices

This seems to be an real and important problem with capacitive touch screens. My elderly mother is often unable to make a touch register on recent Apple devices when a touch appears to have clearly happened and with reasonable force. She blames it on her fingers being "numb" but there genuinely seems to be a problem unrelated to her actions. (I've used the devices in question, and they appear to be fine. This is not an issue where she is not touching the device with her skin or a situation where the device is dirty.)

lukan 2y ago
It was a topic here on HN before. Consensus was, it has to do with the moisture of the skin. Older people have drier skin, so worse touchscreen response.
- SoftTalker 2y ago
  Late 50s in age. I notice it occasionally. I don't think my skin is particularly dry, but don't know where the threshold is on these devices.
- AnimalMuppet 2y ago
  I worked for a company that used a touchscreen, with a user population that skewed older. We thought it was poor circulation, not just dry skin.
  - lukan 2y ago
    Blood circulation? That might be the reason for less moisture, but the physical reason for the sensor not registering would be rather a lack of moisture (so no current), I believe.
- y1n0 2y ago
  Early 50s. I believe it to be a combination of dryer skin, poorer circulation, and calloused fingertips. It’s incredibly frustrating. I didn’t really have a problem until this year.
yborg 2y ago
Same thing with my octogenarian grandmother, her fingertips are often so dry the screen does not register the touch; she has arthritis and poor vision so hand-eye targeting is poor with the tiny touch areas many apps have even on a tablet; the lack of any tactile feedback exacerbates these issues, people this age didn't grow up with capacitive touch screens and the lack of sensation after an action is alien to them. She finds the iPad extremely frustrating. What I found more surprising is that voice control isn't the solution, either. She is very reluctant to talk to Siri because it feels to her like there is an actual person there and she doesn't want to bother them. It would actually be better for her if you could choose a more robotic voice for Siri to make it seem more like a machine. Not looking forward to getting older and having to interact with the brave new world that Big Tech will be bringing us. With some manufacturers you can't even drive a car without using a touchscreen -_-
- SoftTalker 2y ago
  I won't use Siri or voice interfaces either. Just dislike them.
rightbyte 2y ago
I get the same problem when I work in the garden digging a lot. The skin gets thick and dry and touch screens start behaving strange. Not that I can't use them, but like the centre of the tap has an offset.
- Xiol32 2y ago
  I have a similar problem and I honestly only notice it on Apple devices. Android and other random touchscreens seem fine, but my iPad can be a nightmare. I have to touch things multiple times for it to register. The fingerprint reader on there also hates me.
mannycalavera42 2y ago
my 70-something parents both struggle and have to resort - not without disappointment and sadness - to capacitive pens
01100011 2y ago
Mom is almost 82. Just bought her an iPad to try because the computer was getting difficult to use with her essential tremor. Setting it up was a nightmare because I didn't spend the money for a model with face id. She had to keep touching(but not clicking!) the fingerprint reading button on the side. Training her fingerprint was also a nightmare because of Apple's surprisingly bad decision to require you to click a pop-up dialog whenever you fail to position your finger properly, unlike Android where you just try again. I think the touchscreen was the least of her problems. A virtual keyboard with bigger keys would be nice. Not sure if that's an option on Apple though. I'm not convinced she'll have much luck with the iPad, so if anyone has suggestions for an elderly person to stay connected, let me know.
- yieldcrv 2y ago
  maybe in the accessibility settings for bigger keys
- thatguy0900 2y ago
  Newer versions of ios actually have an elderly mode, assistive access, in the accessibility settings that might be of help here
- RhysU 2y ago
  I am glad that she's still managing okay despite her ET. Kudos to you for helping her navigate which interfaces she can use now. My father's ET makes me terrified of gradually losing my own ability to interact with any technology as I become his age and as interfaces "progress". I am always surprised the extent to which "accessibility" does not include people with poor fine motor control.
prerok 2y ago
I frequently have problems with some touch screens, because my fingers are too dry. Seems like some touch screens are better, i.e. I don't notice it at all, and some are intolerably bad.
lurking_swe 2y ago
sounds like a stylus might help her interact with the phone better? they’re very cheap and they sell some larger ones that are easy to hold.
ThrowawayR2 2y ago
Consumer Reports refers to it as "zombie finger syndrome" (https://www.consumerreports.org/cro/news/2015/06/zombie-finger-and-touchscreens/index.htm https://www.consumerreports.org/cro/news/2015/06/zombie-fing...) so it seems to be fairly common. A rather expensive workaround is an Apple Pencil on the iPad Pro but it's out of reach for most people.
Sindisil 2y ago
I'm not yet "elderly " -- contrary to what a troublingly large fraction of younger software developers seem to believe -- but I do have occasional issues with touch screens, for several reasons. They behave unreliability when I use the fingers on my left hand. I play guitar, so I assume that callouses are the issue. Older folks often have calloused finger tips; it's somewhat inevitable. I often make or repair things, as well as work in my yard. At the very least, this often renders fingerprint recognition useless for days or sometimes weeks at a time. Sometimes my finger tips get scuffed enough that it affects touch screen use, too. I wear gloves when I can, but that is its own issue. "Screen friendly" work gloves don't stay that way for long, and aren't great anyway. I also live in a northern area, so for about half the year humidity is very low. Even drinking plenty, and using moisturizer, my skin gets dry enough sometimes to make screens unresponsive. Of course, we also get actual winter here. Even the best "screen friendly" gloves I've tried have been mid at best, just as with work gloves. Certainly not good enough to rely on.

lukan 2y ago

It was a topic here on HN before. Consensus was, it has to do with the moisture of the skin. Older people have drier skin, so worse touchscreen response.

SoftTalker 2y ago
Late 50s in age. I notice it occasionally. I don't think my skin is particularly dry, but don't know where the threshold is on these devices.
AnimalMuppet 2y ago
I worked for a company that used a touchscreen, with a user population that skewed older. We thought it was poor circulation, not just dry skin.
- lukan 2y ago
  Blood circulation? That might be the reason for less moisture, but the physical reason for the sensor not registering would be rather a lack of moisture (so no current), I believe.
y1n0 2y ago
Early 50s. I believe it to be a combination of dryer skin, poorer circulation, and calloused fingertips. It’s incredibly frustrating. I didn’t really have a problem until this year.

yborg 2y ago

Same thing with my octogenarian grandmother, her fingertips are often so dry the screen does not register the touch; she has arthritis and poor vision so hand-eye targeting is poor with the tiny touch areas many apps have even on a tablet; the lack of any tactile feedback exacerbates these issues, people this age didn't grow up with capacitive touch screens and the lack of sensation after an action is alien to them. She finds the iPad extremely frustrating. What I found more surprising is that voice control isn't the solution, either. She is very reluctant to talk to Siri because it feels to her like there is an actual person there and she doesn't want to bother them. It would actually be better for her if you could choose a more robotic voice for Siri to make it seem more like a machine. Not looking forward to getting older and having to interact with the brave new world that Big Tech will be bringing us. With some manufacturers you can't even drive a car without using a touchscreen -_-

SoftTalker 2y ago
I won't use Siri or voice interfaces either. Just dislike them.

rightbyte 2y ago

I get the same problem when I work in the garden digging a lot. The skin gets thick and dry and touch screens start behaving strange. Not that I can't use them, but like the centre of the tap has an offset.

Xiol32 2y ago
I have a similar problem and I honestly only notice it on Apple devices. Android and other random touchscreens seem fine, but my iPad can be a nightmare. I have to touch things multiple times for it to register. The fingerprint reader on there also hates me.

mannycalavera42 2y ago

my 70-something parents both struggle and have to resort - not without disappointment and sadness - to capacitive pens

01100011 2y ago

Mom is almost 82. Just bought her an iPad to try because the computer was getting difficult to use with her essential tremor. Setting it up was a nightmare because I didn't spend the money for a model with face id. She had to keep touching(but not clicking!) the fingerprint reading button on the side. Training her fingerprint was also a nightmare because of Apple's surprisingly bad decision to require you to click a pop-up dialog whenever you fail to position your finger properly, unlike Android where you just try again. I think the touchscreen was the least of her problems. A virtual keyboard with bigger keys would be nice. Not sure if that's an option on Apple though. I'm not convinced she'll have much luck with the iPad, so if anyone has suggestions for an elderly person to stay connected, let me know.

yieldcrv 2y ago
maybe in the accessibility settings for bigger keys
thatguy0900 2y ago
Newer versions of ios actually have an elderly mode, assistive access, in the accessibility settings that might be of help here
RhysU 2y ago
I am glad that she's still managing okay despite her ET. Kudos to you for helping her navigate which interfaces she can use now. My father's ET makes me terrified of gradually losing my own ability to interact with any technology as I become his age and as interfaces "progress". I am always surprised the extent to which "accessibility" does not include people with poor fine motor control.

prerok 2y ago

I frequently have problems with some touch screens, because my fingers are too dry. Seems like some touch screens are better, i.e. I don't notice it at all, and some are intolerably bad.

lurking_swe 2y ago

sounds like a stylus might help her interact with the phone better? they’re very cheap and they sell some larger ones that are easy to hold.

ThrowawayR2 2y ago

Consumer Reports refers to it as "zombie finger syndrome" (https://www.consumerreports.org/cro/news/2015/06/zombie-finger-and-touchscreens/index.htm https://www.consumerreports.org/cro/news/2015/06/zombie-fing...) so it seems to be fairly common. A rather expensive workaround is an Apple Pencil on the iPad Pro but it's out of reach for most people.

Sindisil 2y ago

I'm not yet "elderly " -- contrary to what a troublingly large fraction of younger software developers seem to believe -- but I do have occasional issues with touch screens, for several reasons. They behave unreliability when I use the fingers on my left hand. I play guitar, so I assume that callouses are the issue. Older folks often have calloused finger tips; it's somewhat inevitable. I often make or repair things, as well as work in my yard. At the very least, this often renders fingerprint recognition useless for days or sometimes weeks at a time. Sometimes my finger tips get scuffed enough that it affects touch screen use, too. I wear gloves when I can, but that is its own issue. "Screen friendly" work gloves don't stay that way for long, and aren't great anyway. I also live in a northern area, so for about half the year humidity is very low. Even drinking plenty, and using moisturizer, my skin gets dry enough sometimes to make screens unresponsive. Of course, we also get actual winter here. Even the best "screen friendly" gloves I've tried have been mid at best, just as with work gloves. Certainly not good enough to rely on.