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7,000 times out of how many accesses? 7,636? 10 quadrillion? Does California law enforcement's rate of misuse of information systems exceed, equal, or fall s

7,000 times out of how many accesses? 7,636? 10 quadrillion? Does California law enforcement's rate of misuse of information systems exceed, equal, or fall short of my own misuse (usually unintentional, due to lack of clear policy/guidance) of various information systems?

9283409232 2y ago
I don't think it matters.
- JumpCrisscross 2y ago
  > I don't think it matters Of course it does. It doesn't absolve anything if the rate is low. But the frequency is absolutely meaningful.
  - ceejayoz 2y ago
    Isn’t it a little like Ted Bundy pointing out he hasn’t murdered the vast majority of Americans, though? At the very least, I wonder how many officers are responsible for the violations. 7000? 1? LASD only has 18k employees.
    - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
      > Isn’t it a little like Ted Bundy pointing out he hasn’t murdered the vast majority of Americans, though? No. It's like tracking the homicide rate. The rate going down or being low doesn't mean murder is fine.
    - snakeyjake 2y ago
      >Isn’t it a little like Ted Bundy pointing out he hasn’t murdered the vast majority of Americans, though? You expect there to be no murders. I expect murders to be low, and for murderers to be punished. I also expect the number of murderers in the police force to be only slightly better than that of the rest of society. There are background checks, but there are also other factors that may increase the rate, regardless: I expect from them what I expect from everyone. So-- 7,000 murders per year. For Iceland that's high. I think they had 3 last year. For the United States, that's fucking fantastic! I wish we had 7,000 murders per year! If we had 3 that would be awesome but I'm not delusional. It's all about the wider context. Especially in this case, 6,800 of the misuses were from the LA sheriff's department doing background checks for gun permits so that's almost certainly a policy and procedure problem that has been fixed. So that leaves around 200 cases. Is that good? No. But how bad is it? 200 misuses out of ten quadrillion accesses is pretty not bad, if you ask me. edit: and that's a sign that things are going well because I am not dumb enough to expect 0 misuses of anything by any group of individuals. I expect misuses to be low and for misuse to be punished.
SubiculumCode 2y ago
Yes, the top-line number doesn't tell you much. Additional details matter: Was it one department or endemic? It appears mostly related to one large Sherrif department: """The Los Angeles County Sheriff’s Department (LACSD) sheriff’s department’s 6,789 abuses made up a majority of the record 7,275 violations across California that were reported to the state Department of Justice (CADOJ) in 2023 regarding the California Law Enforcement Telecommunications System (CLETS). """ Does misuse of the databases lead to tangible consequences? Maybe yes: "Across California between 2019 and 2023, there have been: "" 761 investigations of CLETS misuse, resulting in findings of at least 7,635 individual violations of the system’s rules 55 officer suspensions, 50 resignations, and 42 firings related to CLETS misuse six misdemeanor convictions and one felony conviction related to CLETS misuse ""

9283409232 2y ago

I don't think it matters.

JumpCrisscross 2y ago
> I don't think it matters Of course it does. It doesn't absolve anything if the rate is low. But the frequency is absolutely meaningful.
- ceejayoz 2y ago
  Isn’t it a little like Ted Bundy pointing out he hasn’t murdered the vast majority of Americans, though? At the very least, I wonder how many officers are responsible for the violations. 7000? 1? LASD only has 18k employees.
  - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
    > Isn’t it a little like Ted Bundy pointing out he hasn’t murdered the vast majority of Americans, though? No. It's like tracking the homicide rate. The rate going down or being low doesn't mean murder is fine.
  - snakeyjake 2y ago
    >Isn’t it a little like Ted Bundy pointing out he hasn’t murdered the vast majority of Americans, though? You expect there to be no murders. I expect murders to be low, and for murderers to be punished. I also expect the number of murderers in the police force to be only slightly better than that of the rest of society. There are background checks, but there are also other factors that may increase the rate, regardless: I expect from them what I expect from everyone. So-- 7,000 murders per year. For Iceland that's high. I think they had 3 last year. For the United States, that's fucking fantastic! I wish we had 7,000 murders per year! If we had 3 that would be awesome but I'm not delusional. It's all about the wider context. Especially in this case, 6,800 of the misuses were from the LA sheriff's department doing background checks for gun permits so that's almost certainly a policy and procedure problem that has been fixed. So that leaves around 200 cases. Is that good? No. But how bad is it? 200 misuses out of ten quadrillion accesses is pretty not bad, if you ask me. edit: and that's a sign that things are going well because I am not dumb enough to expect 0 misuses of anything by any group of individuals. I expect misuses to be low and for misuse to be punished.

SubiculumCode 2y ago

Yes, the top-line number doesn't tell you much. Additional details matter: Was it one department or endemic? It appears mostly related to one large Sherrif department: """The Los Angeles County Sheriff’s Department (LACSD) sheriff’s department’s 6,789 abuses made up a majority of the record 7,275 violations across California that were reported to the state Department of Justice (CADOJ) in 2023 regarding the California Law Enforcement Telecommunications System (CLETS). """ Does misuse of the databases lead to tangible consequences? Maybe yes: "Across California between 2019 and 2023, there have been: "" 761 investigations of CLETS misuse, resulting in findings of at least 7,635 individual violations of the system’s rules 55 officer suspensions, 50 resignations, and 42 firings related to CLETS misuse six misdemeanor convictions and one felony conviction related to CLETS misuse ""