6 ms·

DCA is great to fly in and out of (I live in DC proper), as it's close, isn't hard to get to, and has a Metro (our subway) station right in front of the termina

DCA is great to fly in and out of (I live in DC proper), as it's close, isn't hard to get to, and has a Metro (our subway) station right in front of the terminal, and the airport is fairly easy to navigate once you're in. Dulles now has a Metro station, but it's still far away from the terminal and it's hard to navigate, with gates very far away from the terminal; other than the Saarinen architecture, everything else about Dulles is awful. BWI is even further from most parts of DC; there's an AmTrak station where you can catch a bus, but pretty much you're driving an hour+ and it's in the middle of exurban hell. DCA is challenging for flights, though, as the approach from upriver over the Potomac requires a sudden bank to the right just before landing and the runway's a bit short (tonight's flight was coming in from the southern approach). The Potomac also has a lot of helicopter traffic, between the military (including POTUS/VPOTUS), US Park Police, DC Police, and civilian flights. DCA's natural advantages have put the screws to Dulles the last 20 years, and Dulles's inability to not suck hasn't helped. As a result, people (including Members of Congress) want more flights out of DCA, so flight traffic has steadily increased. There were two near-misses last spring: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/faa-investigating-collision-ronald-reagan-washington-national-airport-rcna154627 https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/faa-investigating-colli.... Tonight's crash seems like a colossal screwup by the helicopter. DCA is too popular for flight traffic to cease, but I wouldn't be surprised by further restricting the flight corridors and helicopter traffic, more funding/staffing for ATC, and maybe a small reduction in flights.

rob74 2y ago
> more funding/staffing for ATC More funding? From an administration that is currently doing its best to get rid of as many federal employees as possible and has an extra "department" (led by you-know-who) dedicated to that? What they will probably do with ATC is privatize it (which is actually a reasonable thing to do - it's private in most of Europe, but if the intention behind it is to save money, it will probably not improve the system).
- jonstewart 2y ago
  I would not be surprised if ATC _at DCA_ gets some more funding given the complicated air traffic environment and its unique position as Congress’s second-favorite airport.
  - atlasunshrugged 2y ago
    What is Congress' favorite airport?
    - ghaff 2y ago
      Presumably Dulles because international and probably long-haul generally flights. (Though I imagine more fly in and out of Reagan/National on a regular basis.)
      - chgs 2y ago
        When I fly to Washington from Europe I try to go to Baltimore - the number of hours I’ve lost at Dulles immigration arrival is painful, Baltimore is 5-10 minutes.
      - atlasunshrugged 2y ago
        Huh, yeah I think that's maybe the Virginia delegation's favorite airport but I'm highly skeptical it is for other members as it's pretty far and while it does have more flights, I don't think it's incredible. For international flights when traveling for work, many Congresspeople will use milair anyways. For reference, I worked as a staffer in Congress for a couple of years and just picked this up although I've never done any in-depth research
        alistairSH 2y ago
        Congressmen from areas that can serve DCA tend to pick DCA due to proximity/convenience. Noted elsewhere, it's a bit easier to navigate internally (smaller, newer terminal building vs IAD), though I don't know how much that impacts Congressmen - I'm guessing they at minimum are using first class/preferred facilities and not queuing up with us plebes for security. Periodically, Congress pushes to have DCA take more traffic total and from a larger portion of the US. Currently, DCA is limited to destinations 1250 miles away, though powerful Congressmen have obtained permanent waivers for this over the years for specific flights so they get an easy flight to their own home region.
- gosub100 2y ago
  There's a privately controlled tower at KSQL (San Carlos) and there have been numerous incidents of ATC losing their cool on pilots, sometimes brand new students. All the YT comments say it's because it's privately controlled and understaffed and many pilots vouch for similar drama happening to them. I can't prove it, just passing along a data point. Obviously this problem could be solved by paying better and having enough staff. But how likely is that?
  - dghlsakjg 2y ago
    KSQL's current controllers have announced that they are all quitting effective tomorrow. The private corp running the tower lowered their pay by eliminating COL adjustments in the latest contract renewal (a big deal for an airport that is in Palo Alto). This weekend, with no planning, there will be a completely untowered airport operating underneath the airspace of SFO. The management is scrambling right now to prevent this, but the best case scenario is that controllers with no experience or local knowledge in training will be thrown into a tower on the busiest day of the week with no colleagues that have done the job before.
    - gosub100 2y ago
      good for them (I'm not advocating for a more dangerous, uncontrolled airport, I think pilots should not fly there). Any private ATC should be required to put 50-100M in escrow (at a minimum) and/or insurance to cover mass casualty events caused by their failure.
rayiner 2y ago
Thank's for the detailed explanation! I have a warm spot in my heart for Dulles, because it's my first memory of American (we flew into Dulles from Bangladesh in 1989). It's really convenient if you live in Great Falls or Reston. And I loved what was then the semi-rural Virginia around the airport. But agreed, it's a huge pain in the butt to navigate.
- ghaff 2y ago
  For all the hate EWR (Newark) gets, I much prefer to connect through from there to Europe from Boston than Dulles. My biggest objection to EWR is that it's a PITA to get into Manhattan from but, then, that's pretty much true of all the NYC airports. I'm rarely doing that though as I'm almost always taking the train into the city.
MattSayar 2y ago
> the airport is fairly easy to navigate once you're in. I see you skipped talking about how terrible it is navigating the road traffic to arrivals/departures
- jonstewart 2y ago
  You mean if you’re driving? Sometimes there’s bad traffic around the ring and sometimes there’s not, a lot of airports are like that.
  - MattSayar 2y ago
    Specifically the terrible signage and navigation to the right dropoffs

rob74 2y ago

> more funding/staffing for ATC More funding? From an administration that is currently doing its best to get rid of as many federal employees as possible and has an extra "department" (led by you-know-who) dedicated to that? What they will probably do with ATC is privatize it (which is actually a reasonable thing to do - it's private in most of Europe, but if the intention behind it is to save money, it will probably not improve the system).

jonstewart 2y ago
I would not be surprised if ATC _at DCA_ gets some more funding given the complicated air traffic environment and its unique position as Congress’s second-favorite airport.
- atlasunshrugged 2y ago
  What is Congress' favorite airport?
  - ghaff 2y ago
    Presumably Dulles because international and probably long-haul generally flights. (Though I imagine more fly in and out of Reagan/National on a regular basis.)
    - chgs 2y ago
      When I fly to Washington from Europe I try to go to Baltimore - the number of hours I’ve lost at Dulles immigration arrival is painful, Baltimore is 5-10 minutes.
    - atlasunshrugged 2y ago
      Huh, yeah I think that's maybe the Virginia delegation's favorite airport but I'm highly skeptical it is for other members as it's pretty far and while it does have more flights, I don't think it's incredible. For international flights when traveling for work, many Congresspeople will use milair anyways. For reference, I worked as a staffer in Congress for a couple of years and just picked this up although I've never done any in-depth research
      - alistairSH 2y ago
        Congressmen from areas that can serve DCA tend to pick DCA due to proximity/convenience. Noted elsewhere, it's a bit easier to navigate internally (smaller, newer terminal building vs IAD), though I don't know how much that impacts Congressmen - I'm guessing they at minimum are using first class/preferred facilities and not queuing up with us plebes for security. Periodically, Congress pushes to have DCA take more traffic total and from a larger portion of the US. Currently, DCA is limited to destinations 1250 miles away, though powerful Congressmen have obtained permanent waivers for this over the years for specific flights so they get an easy flight to their own home region.
gosub100 2y ago
There's a privately controlled tower at KSQL (San Carlos) and there have been numerous incidents of ATC losing their cool on pilots, sometimes brand new students. All the YT comments say it's because it's privately controlled and understaffed and many pilots vouch for similar drama happening to them. I can't prove it, just passing along a data point. Obviously this problem could be solved by paying better and having enough staff. But how likely is that?
- dghlsakjg 2y ago
  KSQL's current controllers have announced that they are all quitting effective tomorrow. The private corp running the tower lowered their pay by eliminating COL adjustments in the latest contract renewal (a big deal for an airport that is in Palo Alto). This weekend, with no planning, there will be a completely untowered airport operating underneath the airspace of SFO. The management is scrambling right now to prevent this, but the best case scenario is that controllers with no experience or local knowledge in training will be thrown into a tower on the busiest day of the week with no colleagues that have done the job before.
  - gosub100 2y ago
    good for them (I'm not advocating for a more dangerous, uncontrolled airport, I think pilots should not fly there). Any private ATC should be required to put 50-100M in escrow (at a minimum) and/or insurance to cover mass casualty events caused by their failure.

rayiner 2y ago

Thank's for the detailed explanation! I have a warm spot in my heart for Dulles, because it's my first memory of American (we flew into Dulles from Bangladesh in 1989). It's really convenient if you live in Great Falls or Reston. And I loved what was then the semi-rural Virginia around the airport. But agreed, it's a huge pain in the butt to navigate.

ghaff 2y ago
For all the hate EWR (Newark) gets, I much prefer to connect through from there to Europe from Boston than Dulles. My biggest objection to EWR is that it's a PITA to get into Manhattan from but, then, that's pretty much true of all the NYC airports. I'm rarely doing that though as I'm almost always taking the train into the city.

MattSayar 2y ago

> the airport is fairly easy to navigate once you're in. I see you skipped talking about how terrible it is navigating the road traffic to arrivals/departures

jonstewart 2y ago
You mean if you’re driving? Sometimes there’s bad traffic around the ring and sometimes there’s not, a lot of airports are like that.
- MattSayar 2y ago
  Specifically the terrible signage and navigation to the right dropoffs