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Probably because a lot of programmers don't get to choose the language they are using. They have a job developing some existing app that is already written in P

Probably because a lot of programmers don't get to choose the language they are using. They have a job developing some existing app that is already written in Python, but they wish it wasn't Python. They don't have an option to rewrite the whole codebase in Rust or whatever, so the best they can do is advocate for Python to evolve to be more like languages they do like.

gt0 2y ago
I think this is exactly it. My gut instinct is just "Why the obsession with adding static types to Python, just use a language that already has good static types". As you say though, not everybody gets to choose their language, and I certainly wouldn't choose Python if I could possibly help it, so if we can add good static types to Python, it's still not a great language, but it's much improved by static types.
- baq 2y ago
  I’m a Pythonista of two decades who is working with typescript (on the backend) for the past two years and absolutely loving it. I don’t like the js part, but it doesn’t matter too much except when you’re working with numbers, which are a bit insane. If anyone built a typescript layer on top of Python, I’d cheer that effort. If that new thing from the article will be that, I’m stoked.
  - adsharma 2y ago
    Or a better python layer on python. People asking why statically typed python: consider that it's the #1 language on GitHub (assume ts and js are different) and LLMs are really good at generating it.
harel 2y ago
But most people in our profession get to choose their job, don't they? Why would a Python project hire a rust programmer? Why would someone who hates Python work on a Python project? I feel the same way. Sporadic use of type hints is nice, and I use it sometimes for reference, like a very succinct comment. But if I want a typed language, Go, Dart, C or even Java are right there.
- kaashif 2y ago
  > Why would someone who hates Python work on a Python project? I hate every language! For different reasons. But I still like programming.
- mbo 2y ago
  Because sometimes people choose their jobs prioritizing pay, location, title, company, project, role, coworkers, etc. and the language they will primarily use (or even use on a secondary basis) is a lower priority concern. In my case, I have, in the pursuit of my engineering goals, had to dig into a Python component that I did not normally work on or intend to work on. I am thankful it had type hints.
  - harel 2y ago
    But none of these reasons should trigger a "I'm going to change this fundamental thing about x because I don't like it". I don't have anything against typing. I just get annoyed when it gets out of control in a language it wasn't part of to begin with. Just look at how complex typescript typing is to see where it can go. Used pragmatically it's fine. When it's out of control we might as well switch to another language.
    - JambalayaJimbo 2y ago
      The entire ML ecosystem is in python these days. I had a project at work that was Python because of that. Type hints saved me a lot of work in easing other people’s code.
- jaredklewis 2y ago
  Even if we have some choice of jobs, your model only works if programmers have language as their only or most important requirement when job searching. There are lots of factors that might make a job more or less desirable aside from programming language, like location, salary, team, business domain, and so on. Seems pretty plausible that someone can dislike python and still like a job because it checks other boxes.
- 2y ago

gt0 2y ago

I think this is exactly it. My gut instinct is just "Why the obsession with adding static types to Python, just use a language that already has good static types". As you say though, not everybody gets to choose their language, and I certainly wouldn't choose Python if I could possibly help it, so if we can add good static types to Python, it's still not a great language, but it's much improved by static types.

baq 2y ago
I’m a Pythonista of two decades who is working with typescript (on the backend) for the past two years and absolutely loving it. I don’t like the js part, but it doesn’t matter too much except when you’re working with numbers, which are a bit insane. If anyone built a typescript layer on top of Python, I’d cheer that effort. If that new thing from the article will be that, I’m stoked.
- adsharma 2y ago
  Or a better python layer on python. People asking why statically typed python: consider that it's the #1 language on GitHub (assume ts and js are different) and LLMs are really good at generating it.

harel 2y ago

But most people in our profession get to choose their job, don't they? Why would a Python project hire a rust programmer? Why would someone who hates Python work on a Python project? I feel the same way. Sporadic use of type hints is nice, and I use it sometimes for reference, like a very succinct comment. But if I want a typed language, Go, Dart, C or even Java are right there.

kaashif 2y ago
> Why would someone who hates Python work on a Python project? I hate every language! For different reasons. But I still like programming.
mbo 2y ago
Because sometimes people choose their jobs prioritizing pay, location, title, company, project, role, coworkers, etc. and the language they will primarily use (or even use on a secondary basis) is a lower priority concern. In my case, I have, in the pursuit of my engineering goals, had to dig into a Python component that I did not normally work on or intend to work on. I am thankful it had type hints.
- harel 2y ago
  But none of these reasons should trigger a "I'm going to change this fundamental thing about x because I don't like it". I don't have anything against typing. I just get annoyed when it gets out of control in a language it wasn't part of to begin with. Just look at how complex typescript typing is to see where it can go. Used pragmatically it's fine. When it's out of control we might as well switch to another language.
  - JambalayaJimbo 2y ago
    The entire ML ecosystem is in python these days. I had a project at work that was Python because of that. Type hints saved me a lot of work in easing other people’s code.
jaredklewis 2y ago
Even if we have some choice of jobs, your model only works if programmers have language as their only or most important requirement when job searching. There are lots of factors that might make a job more or less desirable aside from programming language, like location, salary, team, business domain, and so on. Seems pretty plausible that someone can dislike python and still like a job because it checks other boxes.
2y ago