4 ms·

I don't think this is a good idea. I think that when someone sees a comment that would otherwise not be agreeable on a personal level, when it has votes from ma

I don't think this is a good idea. I think that when someone sees a comment that would otherwise not be agreeable on a personal level, when it has votes from many other members, it has a tendency to sway your personal convictions a bit, just enough to make you second guess your own opinions. Let a comment stand for its merit. I honestly wish they'd take names off the comments too. I feel like there are way too many recognizeable handles around here, which can have a similar effect of self-fulfilling prophecy. Case in point: has PG ever been downvoted? Ever?

tokenadult 14y ago
Case in point: has PG ever been downvoted? Ever? I downvoted a recent comment by pg that for quite a while was (and STILL is) the top comment in its thread http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4253156 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4253156 but that pg later acknowledged didn't have a sufficient factual basis. http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4254592 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4254592 Conspiracy theories are very enticing to the human mind, so they often get too many upvotes here on HN. Although I did downvote pg's first comment in the thread mentioned here, I was outnumbered by many more people who upvoted it, mistakenly.
- jeswin 14y ago
  It is perhaps more useful when a mistake is corrected with a reply/comment, than with a down-vote. Doing so gets people to read both. Besides in the absence of the original comment (incorrect as it may be), the followups lose context. Reserve down votes for opinions that do not deserve a reply. Such as pure trolling.
  - scott_s 14y ago
    Top comments in a thread frame discussion - if the top comment in a thread is a conspiracy theory, then it's likely that the entire discussion will be derailed. For that reason, I think it's valid to downvote such comments, to prevent them from derailing the discussion.
temphn 14y ago
He was definitely downvoted during the AirBnB hysteria last summer.
mixmax 14y ago
It's a signal to noise problem. In a perfect world I would research each comment, do basic background checkes against stated facts, think through the implications of the comment, etc. and then form an unbiased opinion. I would do this with every comment thread. After I had done this I would be uniquely qualified to form an opinion on every comment, and I would be wise because I'd read and understood all the comments. I'd also have spent most of my day doing so. The reason comment scores, and usernames as a proxy for scores, are interesting is that it's a good way of cutting through the noise. Most people just don't have the time to read through all comments on a thread and form an opinion on each one seperately. That's what I'm really missing about the points - I don't care how many points a certain poster or a certain comment has, but I do care greatly to have an indicator of quality so that I can skim through a thread and pick out the best comments. Particularly on long comment threads where I don't know much about the subject, or on busy days.
- dennisgorelik 14y ago
  You are an optimist. In a perfect world it would take you 100++ hours to read and research all HN comments per day.
  - dfc 14y ago
    That is why in a "perfect world" thought experiment, resources are not finite.
- Androsynth 14y ago
  or.... you could just read the comment and form an opinion based on the content. The reason comment scores are bad is that it leads to leads to anchoring. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anchoring http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anchoring This is probably why dumb and/or mean comments get upvoted (as discussed in tokenadults top comment).
gurkendoktor 14y ago
> I honestly wish they'd take names off the comments too I have seen familiar (absolutely not famous) handles from IRC on HN on two occasions. Made me happy. I can't turn this into a more rational point, though.
- politician 14y ago
  Names are helpful iff high-karma users help reinforce pg's goals for the site. In my experience that is the case, and the site provides a higher-than-average quality of discussion.
pasbesoin 14y ago
I've seen a rather light gray pg comment -- not too long ago. Although I don't remember the context, and I don't know whether it stayed that way.
randallsquared 14y ago
I think that when someone sees a comment that would otherwise not be agreeable on a personal level, when it has votes from many other members, it has a tendency to sway your personal convictions a bit, just enough to make you second guess your own opinions. This seems like a benefit to me. If I'm skimming through a comments page on a topic I'm not fully familiar with, seeing an opinion I would otherwise disagree with voted up should make me update; it's evidence against my current opinion.
larrys 14y ago
"I honestly wish they'd take names off the comments too." I agree with the halo effect. On the other hand knowing that you are building a brand in your handle gives motivation to put in more effort. Not everyone thinks like Job's father ("you will know that the other side wasn't painted" (or whatever that quote was)) I thought an interesting idea would be to run a test of the top karma-ers and have them post replies w/o their actual handle and then compare the karma rating they get. There are of course a few problems with this. If the comment is of high quality the fact that it's associated with a brand new handle might paradoxically get it higher votes. "Hmm this new guy knows his stuff.." Add: The other issue is that there may be a little cousing of Hawthorne effect on the part of the commenter. Trying even harder to prove a point that it isn't their handle. Sometimes the top comment is from someone where you recognize the handle. And the comment is good. But it doesn't seem that good. Same many times PG says anything. He gives brief answers and the way they rank sometimes it's like SCOTUS is talking to someone low on the food chain in the legal profession. (Same with what Fred Wilson says on his blog btw.) I don't typically upvote anything PG does. To me it's like tipping the owner! And it's not like he needs the karma score. Off the top I don't ever remember seeing a PG comment that is not near the top of the thread or subthread. (I would love if PG were to do the anonymous handle idea and then publish the results.)

tokenadult 14y ago

Case in point: has PG ever been downvoted? Ever? I downvoted a recent comment by pg that for quite a while was (and STILL is) the top comment in its thread http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4253156 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4253156 but that pg later acknowledged didn't have a sufficient factual basis. http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4254592 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=4254592 Conspiracy theories are very enticing to the human mind, so they often get too many upvotes here on HN. Although I did downvote pg's first comment in the thread mentioned here, I was outnumbered by many more people who upvoted it, mistakenly.

jeswin 14y ago
It is perhaps more useful when a mistake is corrected with a reply/comment, than with a down-vote. Doing so gets people to read both. Besides in the absence of the original comment (incorrect as it may be), the followups lose context. Reserve down votes for opinions that do not deserve a reply. Such as pure trolling.
- scott_s 14y ago
  Top comments in a thread frame discussion - if the top comment in a thread is a conspiracy theory, then it's likely that the entire discussion will be derailed. For that reason, I think it's valid to downvote such comments, to prevent them from derailing the discussion.

temphn 14y ago

He was definitely downvoted during the AirBnB hysteria last summer.

mixmax 14y ago

It's a signal to noise problem. In a perfect world I would research each comment, do basic background checkes against stated facts, think through the implications of the comment, etc. and then form an unbiased opinion. I would do this with every comment thread. After I had done this I would be uniquely qualified to form an opinion on every comment, and I would be wise because I'd read and understood all the comments. I'd also have spent most of my day doing so. The reason comment scores, and usernames as a proxy for scores, are interesting is that it's a good way of cutting through the noise. Most people just don't have the time to read through all comments on a thread and form an opinion on each one seperately. That's what I'm really missing about the points - I don't care how many points a certain poster or a certain comment has, but I do care greatly to have an indicator of quality so that I can skim through a thread and pick out the best comments. Particularly on long comment threads where I don't know much about the subject, or on busy days.

dennisgorelik 14y ago
You are an optimist. In a perfect world it would take you 100++ hours to read and research all HN comments per day.
- dfc 14y ago
  That is why in a "perfect world" thought experiment, resources are not finite.
Androsynth 14y ago
or.... you could just read the comment and form an opinion based on the content. The reason comment scores are bad is that it leads to leads to anchoring. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anchoring http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anchoring This is probably why dumb and/or mean comments get upvoted (as discussed in tokenadults top comment).

gurkendoktor 14y ago

> I honestly wish they'd take names off the comments too I have seen familiar (absolutely not famous) handles from IRC on HN on two occasions. Made me happy. I can't turn this into a more rational point, though.

politician 14y ago
Names are helpful iff high-karma users help reinforce pg's goals for the site. In my experience that is the case, and the site provides a higher-than-average quality of discussion.

pasbesoin 14y ago

I've seen a rather light gray pg comment -- not too long ago. Although I don't remember the context, and I don't know whether it stayed that way.

randallsquared 14y ago

I think that when someone sees a comment that would otherwise not be agreeable on a personal level, when it has votes from many other members, it has a tendency to sway your personal convictions a bit, just enough to make you second guess your own opinions. This seems like a benefit to me. If I'm skimming through a comments page on a topic I'm not fully familiar with, seeing an opinion I would otherwise disagree with voted up should make me update; it's evidence against my current opinion.

larrys 14y ago

"I honestly wish they'd take names off the comments too." I agree with the halo effect. On the other hand knowing that you are building a brand in your handle gives motivation to put in more effort. Not everyone thinks like Job's father ("you will know that the other side wasn't painted" (or whatever that quote was)) I thought an interesting idea would be to run a test of the top karma-ers and have them post replies w/o their actual handle and then compare the karma rating they get. There are of course a few problems with this. If the comment is of high quality the fact that it's associated with a brand new handle might paradoxically get it higher votes. "Hmm this new guy knows his stuff.." Add: The other issue is that there may be a little cousing of Hawthorne effect on the part of the commenter. Trying even harder to prove a point that it isn't their handle. Sometimes the top comment is from someone where you recognize the handle. And the comment is good. But it doesn't seem that good. Same many times PG says anything. He gives brief answers and the way they rank sometimes it's like SCOTUS is talking to someone low on the food chain in the legal profession. (Same with what Fred Wilson says on his blog btw.) I don't typically upvote anything PG does. To me it's like tipping the owner! And it's not like he needs the karma score. Off the top I don't ever remember seeing a PG comment that is not near the top of the thread or subthread. (I would love if PG were to do the anonymous handle idea and then publish the results.)