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>"support," whateverTF that means security patches >It sounds like something I don't want, if it means forcibly installing software. HN readers might be comp

by gruez 2y ago

>"support," whateverTF that means security patches >It sounds like something I don't want, if it means forcibly installing software. HN readers might be competent enough to avoid malware even with vulnerable systems, but people like your aunt need all the help they can get. That includes a operating system that doesn't have EoP exploits that allow malicious code to escape from browser sandboxes. Forcing updates by default is probably a good thing. Disabling updates isn't hard if you're technically inclined, and if you can't you're probably better off having a patched system than being mildly annoyed that you have to restart your system every month for updates.

mike_d 2y ago
> security patches You have fallen victim to Microsoft intentionally blurring the line between security patching and software changes. A security fix should never be bundled with or uninstallable without a UI/feature change unless that change is critical to fixing the vulnerability.
- ryandrake 2y ago
  Yea, I would almost be OK with security patches being automatically applied by default (as long as there was a clear way to turn them off). I'd grumble about it, because ultimately I should be in charge of what gets installed and run on my computer, and I feel my computer should not do things that I have not deliberately commanded it to do. But just force-feeding me software simply because the manufacturer wants me to run it? No bueno.
- gruez 2y ago
  >A security fix should never be bundled with or uninstallable without a UI/feature change unless that change is critical to fixing the vulnerability. That's a nice thought but in practice it's infeasible to keep different branches for different UI/feature sets around in perpetuity. Consumer of Windows only gets 2 years of support, which is short compared to Ubuntu's 5 years of support for LTS (10 years if you pay them), but you can get similar support periods through enterprise contracts. It's also longer than mobile platforms, which only offer 1 year (if that).
  - hulitu 2y ago
    > That's a nice thought but in practice it's infeasible to keep different branches for different UI/feature sets around in perpetuity. So fixing a big here, introducing a bug there. /s
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
  - mike_d 2y ago
    > That's a nice thought but in practice it's infeasible to keep different branches for different UI/feature sets around in perpetuity. They have been doing exactly that since Windows 98. Windows Update used to only auto install security/bug patches and features were optional installs. Microsoft also has an entire line of POSReady/WEI that gets only critical security fixes with zero other changes. This version of Windows is what runs on ATMs and self checkout machines.

by gruez 2y ago

mike_d 2y ago

> security patches You have fallen victim to Microsoft intentionally blurring the line between security patching and software changes. A security fix should never be bundled with or uninstallable without a UI/feature change unless that change is critical to fixing the vulnerability.

ryandrake 2y ago
Yea, I would almost be OK with security patches being automatically applied by default (as long as there was a clear way to turn them off). I'd grumble about it, because ultimately I should be in charge of what gets installed and run on my computer, and I feel my computer should not do things that I have not deliberately commanded it to do. But just force-feeding me software simply because the manufacturer wants me to run it? No bueno.
gruez 2y ago
>A security fix should never be bundled with or uninstallable without a UI/feature change unless that change is critical to fixing the vulnerability. That's a nice thought but in practice it's infeasible to keep different branches for different UI/feature sets around in perpetuity. Consumer of Windows only gets 2 years of support, which is short compared to Ubuntu's 5 years of support for LTS (10 years if you pay them), but you can get similar support periods through enterprise contracts. It's also longer than mobile platforms, which only offer 1 year (if that).
- hulitu 2y ago
  > That's a nice thought but in practice it's infeasible to keep different branches for different UI/feature sets around in perpetuity. So fixing a big here, introducing a bug there. /s
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- mike_d 2y ago
  > That's a nice thought but in practice it's infeasible to keep different branches for different UI/feature sets around in perpetuity. They have been doing exactly that since Windows 98. Windows Update used to only auto install security/bug patches and features were optional installs. Microsoft also has an entire line of POSReady/WEI that gets only critical security fixes with zero other changes. This version of Windows is what runs on ATMs and self checkout machines.