4 ms·

Pardoning Ulbricht was a campaign promise he made at the Libertarian National Convention in response to it being a popular demand among the libertarians.

noirbot 2y ago
And more importantly, among the crypto crowd that dumped millions into his campaign. Libertarians have essentially no clout or money on their own. This was a pardon bought by Coinbase and Gemini and A16z.
- twelve40 2y ago
  Why would Coinbase and Gemini and A16z care about an obviously shady person who reportedly tried to hire a person to kill someone? surely they could find a more legitimate hero to advance the legal crypto case? i mean, it's kind of like them - companies trying to do legit crypto - rallying today around SBF when they already have image problems from other exchanges?
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
  - talldayo 2y ago
    There is no "legit crypto" - it's a myth. Every single exchange that swaps spit with the Bitcoin ledger is laundering money made by criminal (often violent or fraudulent) means. Many if not most altcoins are equally as fraudulent, or used to launder ("tumble") other suspicious coins. Let's be honest anyways, the cryptocurrency "industry" as we know it is less than 4 years old, and in 4 years it may be gone. Exchanges like coinbase and so-called defi innovators like A16Z need this legally-dubious signalling or they'll risk never having another leader corrupt enough to sanction their behavior.
    - beeflet 2y ago
      I got cash out of an airport currency exchange ATM the other week, and when I tried to use it to by groceries yesterday, the cashier tested it for cocaine and it came back positive. There is no "legit cash".
      - handsclean 2y ago
        “I stepped in a puddle once. There is no ‘dry land.’” —Man in ocean
      - cycrutchfield 2y ago
        [flagged]
      - denkmoon 2y ago
        Are cashiers really testing notes for cocaine? That's insane.
        AlexandrB 2y ago
        What's even the point? It's still legal tender, I don't think they can refuse it.
        tombert 2y ago
        I think that might be a myth? If I tried buying a $0.50 candy bar with a hundred-dollar bill, I think that the cashier might refuse it and I don't think they'd get in trouble for doing so. I thought the "legal tender" argument only worked in regards to debts to the government, though IANAL.
        eadler 2y ago
        Relevant Law: https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/31/5103 https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/31/5103 Good explanation: https://www.forbes.com/sites/nathanlewis/2017/04/18/what-is-a-legal-tender-law-and-is-it-a-problem/ https://www.forbes.com/sites/nathanlewis/2017/04/18/what-is-... Another distinction here is that a store is offering a contract. It isn't a debt until the contracted is accepted.
  - pyrale 2y ago
    If even the worst are untouchable, who will try to examine the good-looking ones?
  - noirbot 2y ago
    Not sure, but when they have various political candidates getting millions from the crypto PACs and all of them in unison talking about how Ross Ulbricht needs a pardon, I'm not sure what else to tell you. Maybe someone just knew Ulbricht personally and is using their money to spring him. But unless you can point to any other group with actual power and money who was pushing for it, the most obvious answer is that the main funders of the crypto PACs were at least ok with it. There's no way they couldn't have subtly squashed this pardon with Trump if it was just the Libertarians asking for it given that they seem to have gotten him to commit to do literally everything else they want.
  - rchaud 2y ago
    Because much like the billionnaires already flanking Trump, the heads of Coinbase and A16Z are out-of-touch charisma black holes that have no clue how to talk to the average Trump voter to get them on their side. Ross Ulbricht is the avatar for their ultimate goal of legitimizing crypto in the US financial system.
ttyprintk 2y ago
I’d like to know who wrote that speech. A lot of talk about how libertarians are domineered and persecuted. Something like “after criminal prosecutions, if I wasn’t a libertarian then, I sure am now” in front of a very idealistic audience whose skepticism of government is unrelated to how many billionaires it fingerprints. So, they booed and heckled him, and in hindsight I wonder if he was grasping for concessions.
barnabee 2y ago
No love for Trump or libertarians but I am a cypherpunk[0] at heart. I'm on board with the idea of ensuring that things can happen online outside of the jurisdiction of any nation[1], so for his part in building towards that I'm happy Ross is free. On the other hand, it's clear to me that the correct amount of jail time wasn't zero either, given everything else he allegedly did. [0] https://www.activism.net/cypherpunk/manifesto.html https://www.activism.net/cypherpunk/manifesto.html [1] I think about this in the same way that we accept the possibility of bad things happening because people can have private conversations in their own home, or are able to have complete control over potentially dangerous tools and vehicles. IMO the risks are worth the trade-offs and these are important rights to protect in the relationship between people, technology, and government (or whoever wields power).

noirbot 2y ago

And more importantly, among the crypto crowd that dumped millions into his campaign. Libertarians have essentially no clout or money on their own. This was a pardon bought by Coinbase and Gemini and A16z.

twelve40 2y ago
Why would Coinbase and Gemini and A16z care about an obviously shady person who reportedly tried to hire a person to kill someone? surely they could find a more legitimate hero to advance the legal crypto case? i mean, it's kind of like them - companies trying to do legit crypto - rallying today around SBF when they already have image problems from other exchanges?
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- talldayo 2y ago
  There is no "legit crypto" - it's a myth. Every single exchange that swaps spit with the Bitcoin ledger is laundering money made by criminal (often violent or fraudulent) means. Many if not most altcoins are equally as fraudulent, or used to launder ("tumble") other suspicious coins. Let's be honest anyways, the cryptocurrency "industry" as we know it is less than 4 years old, and in 4 years it may be gone. Exchanges like coinbase and so-called defi innovators like A16Z need this legally-dubious signalling or they'll risk never having another leader corrupt enough to sanction their behavior.
  - beeflet 2y ago
    I got cash out of an airport currency exchange ATM the other week, and when I tried to use it to by groceries yesterday, the cashier tested it for cocaine and it came back positive. There is no "legit cash".
    - handsclean 2y ago
      “I stepped in a puddle once. There is no ‘dry land.’” —Man in ocean
    - cycrutchfield 2y ago
      [flagged]
    - denkmoon 2y ago
      Are cashiers really testing notes for cocaine? That's insane.
      - AlexandrB 2y ago
        What's even the point? It's still legal tender, I don't think they can refuse it.
        tombert 2y ago
        I think that might be a myth? If I tried buying a $0.50 candy bar with a hundred-dollar bill, I think that the cashier might refuse it and I don't think they'd get in trouble for doing so. I thought the "legal tender" argument only worked in regards to debts to the government, though IANAL.
        eadler 2y ago
        Relevant Law: https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/31/5103 https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/31/5103 Good explanation: https://www.forbes.com/sites/nathanlewis/2017/04/18/what-is-a-legal-tender-law-and-is-it-a-problem/ https://www.forbes.com/sites/nathanlewis/2017/04/18/what-is-... Another distinction here is that a store is offering a contract. It isn't a debt until the contracted is accepted.
- pyrale 2y ago
  If even the worst are untouchable, who will try to examine the good-looking ones?
- noirbot 2y ago
  Not sure, but when they have various political candidates getting millions from the crypto PACs and all of them in unison talking about how Ross Ulbricht needs a pardon, I'm not sure what else to tell you. Maybe someone just knew Ulbricht personally and is using their money to spring him. But unless you can point to any other group with actual power and money who was pushing for it, the most obvious answer is that the main funders of the crypto PACs were at least ok with it. There's no way they couldn't have subtly squashed this pardon with Trump if it was just the Libertarians asking for it given that they seem to have gotten him to commit to do literally everything else they want.
- rchaud 2y ago
  Because much like the billionnaires already flanking Trump, the heads of Coinbase and A16Z are out-of-touch charisma black holes that have no clue how to talk to the average Trump voter to get them on their side. Ross Ulbricht is the avatar for their ultimate goal of legitimizing crypto in the US financial system.

ttyprintk 2y ago

I’d like to know who wrote that speech. A lot of talk about how libertarians are domineered and persecuted. Something like “after criminal prosecutions, if I wasn’t a libertarian then, I sure am now” in front of a very idealistic audience whose skepticism of government is unrelated to how many billionaires it fingerprints. So, they booed and heckled him, and in hindsight I wonder if he was grasping for concessions.

barnabee 2y ago

No love for Trump or libertarians but I am a cypherpunk[0] at heart. I'm on board with the idea of ensuring that things can happen online outside of the jurisdiction of any nation[1], so for his part in building towards that I'm happy Ross is free. On the other hand, it's clear to me that the correct amount of jail time wasn't zero either, given everything else he allegedly did. [0] https://www.activism.net/cypherpunk/manifesto.html https://www.activism.net/cypherpunk/manifesto.html [1] I think about this in the same way that we accept the possibility of bad things happening because people can have private conversations in their own home, or are able to have complete control over potentially dangerous tools and vehicles. IMO the risks are worth the trade-offs and these are important rights to protect in the relationship between people, technology, and government (or whoever wields power).