4 ms·

> If no one tried to make the world a better place, the world would never get better. This is kind of a cost-benefit issue though. The benefits of having a lo

> If no one tried to make the world a better place, the world would never get better. This is kind of a cost-benefit issue though. The benefits of having a local community outweigh the negatives of the platform having its own issues. If your issues on the platform cause you to ditch it, which ruins your community, than what have you actually done? I believe when it comes to anything that is not-for-profit, that the path of least resistance the only path. Therefore moving off of Facebook is simply not a consideration.

cyanydeez 2y ago
you're arguing local, short term benefits with global long term damage. Very near sighted, but an actual problem government, good governance, has struggled with absolutely. Part of the techno fascism is emerging because people are entirely easily manipulated with todays egg prices and not tomorrows suffering of human rights.
- bko 2y ago
  > techno fascism I keep hearing this. What does this mean? My guess would be "a system in which big technology firms can effectively censor speech with coordination from the state". But I think those that use it mean something else.
  - jfactorial 2y ago
    I think "techno fascism" is a term people are using to describe tech company CEOs operating as unelected oligarchs embedded within the new US government. If you're looking for a better term, we could call it "technocratic anti-liberalism" to perhaps cover all the bases. People are attempting to describe the current situation in which the wealthiest humans in all of history are supporting an anti-liberal executive by making financial donations to anti-liberal leadership and making changes to their products to further the messages thereof, e.g. broadcasting Nazi ideology and making Nazi salutes. "Wealthy" as in "holding more personal wealth than the bottom half of the US population"; "anti-liberal" as in "espousing and acting in opposition to classical liberal values of consent of the governed and equality under law by denying the validity of elections, attempting to overthrow the US liberal democratic government with force, pardoning foot soldiers found guilty of such an attack, utilizing king-like executive direction to undermine the highest law of the land, avoiding all punishment for his own guilt, and so forth. That's how I interpret the term.
    - PaulHoule 2y ago
      I'd say categorically that fascism is not a helpful term to describe movements outside the 1900-1945 period in Europe. (e.g. Japan's movement was anti-colonial if anything, Tokugawa Japan would have been happy to be left alone to gaze its navel, if that wasn't possible it wanted the asia-pacific region as a buffer zone) Today it is "Keir Starmer is a fascist" (Sci-fi writer Charlie Stross), "the local people department is fascist" (BLM supporters), I half expect to hear "Jesus was a fascist" although certainly that accusation is leveled at his followers. There's something seductive about the imagery in Pink Floyd's The Wall and V is for Vendetta that is evocative of the period. Perhaps today's political systems are on the brink of failure due to inaction the way that the remnants of European aristocracy were. But we're not going to face what we're up against using "thought stopping" terms. One could make the case that the real problem with "people worried about the price of eggs" is a lack of meaning and that Trump's talk about going to Mars or annexing Greenland addresses that more directly, as do the fantasies of fascism which can elevate ordinary feelings of despair.
      - spencerflem 2y ago
        Elon Musk did a Nazi salute, live on stage, twice
        PaulHoule 2y ago
        They told General McArthur when he was getting a tickertape parade to never hold his hand higher than heart level otherwise people would accuse him of making a Nazi salute. As for Musk, I think he's mentally ill, I think he may have what I've got.
        spencerflem 2y ago
        If that's austism, I know several severely austistic people and am diagnosed autistic myself and absolutely none of us have done what can only possibly be described as a Seig Heil. I refuse to believe it was accident.
  - archagon 2y ago
    Big tech leadership cheerily cozying up to an authoritarian president, felon, and rapist who started an insurrection and literally tried to overthrow the last election. Musk — one of the most powerful people in Washington — doing things like throwing a sieg heil salute, supporting the AfD, claiming that "Hitler was a communist,"[1] and calling for the execution of a government witness[2]. Thiel proclaiming to "no longer believe that freedom and democracy are compatible," and then half of Silicon Valley showing up to party with him[3]. Techno fascism is what it says on the tin: technologists who are very happy with fascism for the sake of money and power. (Just don't call them fascists, they hate that.) [1]: https://www.wired.com/story/elon-musk-far-right-german-leader-weidel-hitler-communist/ https://www.wired.com/story/elon-musk-far-right-german-leade... [2]: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-elon-musk-vindman-treason-impeachment-b2655133.html https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politic... [3]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42773678 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42773678
    - throwway120385 2y ago
      A lot of really smart people in the 1930's were also really into eugenics and forced sterilization and so on. Hitler had a lot of support, even in the US, for what he was doing openly. Being smart doesn't prevent you from being an asshole. Only being empathetic does, and you don't have to be smart to be empathetic.
    - deleted 2y ago
      [deleted]
- pixl97 2y ago
  >you're arguing local, short term benefits Whelp, we know which one is going to win then. An economic benefit now wins the vast majority of the time.
  - cyanydeez 2y ago
    Yes, local maximums are deceptive and should be pointed at as often as possible
computerthings 2y ago
Well, they asked about ways to do something, not whether to do it.

cyanydeez 2y ago

you're arguing local, short term benefits with global long term damage. Very near sighted, but an actual problem government, good governance, has struggled with absolutely. Part of the techno fascism is emerging because people are entirely easily manipulated with todays egg prices and not tomorrows suffering of human rights.

bko 2y ago
> techno fascism I keep hearing this. What does this mean? My guess would be "a system in which big technology firms can effectively censor speech with coordination from the state". But I think those that use it mean something else.
- jfactorial 2y ago
  I think "techno fascism" is a term people are using to describe tech company CEOs operating as unelected oligarchs embedded within the new US government. If you're looking for a better term, we could call it "technocratic anti-liberalism" to perhaps cover all the bases. People are attempting to describe the current situation in which the wealthiest humans in all of history are supporting an anti-liberal executive by making financial donations to anti-liberal leadership and making changes to their products to further the messages thereof, e.g. broadcasting Nazi ideology and making Nazi salutes. "Wealthy" as in "holding more personal wealth than the bottom half of the US population"; "anti-liberal" as in "espousing and acting in opposition to classical liberal values of consent of the governed and equality under law by denying the validity of elections, attempting to overthrow the US liberal democratic government with force, pardoning foot soldiers found guilty of such an attack, utilizing king-like executive direction to undermine the highest law of the land, avoiding all punishment for his own guilt, and so forth. That's how I interpret the term.
  - PaulHoule 2y ago
    I'd say categorically that fascism is not a helpful term to describe movements outside the 1900-1945 period in Europe. (e.g. Japan's movement was anti-colonial if anything, Tokugawa Japan would have been happy to be left alone to gaze its navel, if that wasn't possible it wanted the asia-pacific region as a buffer zone) Today it is "Keir Starmer is a fascist" (Sci-fi writer Charlie Stross), "the local people department is fascist" (BLM supporters), I half expect to hear "Jesus was a fascist" although certainly that accusation is leveled at his followers. There's something seductive about the imagery in Pink Floyd's The Wall and V is for Vendetta that is evocative of the period. Perhaps today's political systems are on the brink of failure due to inaction the way that the remnants of European aristocracy were. But we're not going to face what we're up against using "thought stopping" terms. One could make the case that the real problem with "people worried about the price of eggs" is a lack of meaning and that Trump's talk about going to Mars or annexing Greenland addresses that more directly, as do the fantasies of fascism which can elevate ordinary feelings of despair.
    - spencerflem 2y ago
      Elon Musk did a Nazi salute, live on stage, twice
      - PaulHoule 2y ago
        They told General McArthur when he was getting a tickertape parade to never hold his hand higher than heart level otherwise people would accuse him of making a Nazi salute. As for Musk, I think he's mentally ill, I think he may have what I've got.
        spencerflem 2y ago
        If that's austism, I know several severely austistic people and am diagnosed autistic myself and absolutely none of us have done what can only possibly be described as a Seig Heil. I refuse to believe it was accident.
- archagon 2y ago
  Big tech leadership cheerily cozying up to an authoritarian president, felon, and rapist who started an insurrection and literally tried to overthrow the last election. Musk — one of the most powerful people in Washington — doing things like throwing a sieg heil salute, supporting the AfD, claiming that "Hitler was a communist,"[1] and calling for the execution of a government witness[2]. Thiel proclaiming to "no longer believe that freedom and democracy are compatible," and then half of Silicon Valley showing up to party with him[3]. Techno fascism is what it says on the tin: technologists who are very happy with fascism for the sake of money and power. (Just don't call them fascists, they hate that.) [1]: https://www.wired.com/story/elon-musk-far-right-german-leader-weidel-hitler-communist/ https://www.wired.com/story/elon-musk-far-right-german-leade... [2]: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-elon-musk-vindman-treason-impeachment-b2655133.html https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politic... [3]: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42773678 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42773678
  - throwway120385 2y ago
    A lot of really smart people in the 1930's were also really into eugenics and forced sterilization and so on. Hitler had a lot of support, even in the US, for what he was doing openly. Being smart doesn't prevent you from being an asshole. Only being empathetic does, and you don't have to be smart to be empathetic.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
pixl97 2y ago
>you're arguing local, short term benefits Whelp, we know which one is going to win then. An economic benefit now wins the vast majority of the time.
- cyanydeez 2y ago
  Yes, local maximums are deceptive and should be pointed at as often as possible

computerthings 2y ago

Well, they asked about ways to do something, not whether to do it.