4 ms·

What about neopronouns? Can someone just make up a new set of words like zi / zim / zis and expect you to remember them whenever talking to or about that person

What about neopronouns? Can someone just make up a new set of words like zi / zim / zis and expect you to remember them whenever talking to or about that person?

djur 2y ago
You already remember what standard pronouns to use to refer to each person in your life. They're words you learned right from the start of learning the language. The same isn't true of "neopronouns".
- crackercrews 2y ago
  You seem to be in agreement with my sentiment. There is also additional work in remembering which pronoun to use with which NB person. With most people, you just automatically say the right thing.
foldr 2y ago
What have you done so far in cases where a coworker has asked you to refer to them only using a neopronoun?
- crackercrews 2y ago
  As others have suggested I just avoid pronouns. This seems to be a common approach.
  - foldr 2y ago
    Seems like a practical solution. So what’s the problem?
    - crackercrews 2y ago
      Probably that gender ideology played a sizable role in getting Trump re-elected. It was the topic of his most popular ad, and IIRC the plurality of swing state voters said it was the most important issue for them. So getting people to use preferred pronouns was a bit of a Pyrrhic victory in my book.
      - foldr 2y ago
        >IIRC the plurality of swing state voters said [gender ideology] was the most important issue for them. I don't think that you RC. Citation very much needed here. The issue of neopronouns is largely theoretical, since almost all users of neopronouns also accept the gender neutral 'they'. The Trump ads weren't about neopronouns, and I doubt that most Trump voters (or indeed most Democratic voters) could tell you what a neopronoun is. Using people's preferred pronouns out of he/she/they is just common courtesy. It's essentially what everyone, social conservatives included, already does whenever they take someone's word regarding their gender rather than looking down their pants before talking about them in the third person.
        crackercrews 2y ago
        Eh, ok. [1] I guess there must be another reason Trump's campaign spent hundreds of millions of dollars broadcasting that ad. It was way more than they spent on any other ad. You're moving the goalpost here and pretending that neopronouns is not that big an issue. But it's obviously just part of the gender ideology issue, which was clearly part of the reason Trump won. I can see that there are still people out there with their heads in the sand. I wonder who you'll help elect next time around? 1: https://www.megynkelly.com/2024/11/11/survey-finds-trans-issue-was-top-concern-for-swing-voters-in-2024/ https://www.megynkelly.com/2024/11/11/survey-finds-trans-iss...
        foldr 2y ago
        You said ‘swing state voters’. The survey you indirectly link to is talking about ‘swing voters’: >Our definition of swing voters includes those who are undecided in the presidential race, have changed their voting preference since 2020 (voting Democrat in one election and Republican in the other), or are independents who either indicate they split their votes between Democrats and Republicans, or who hold either favorable or unfavorable views of both Trump and Harris. The sample of voters is weighted towards swing states, but judging by the numbers for 'All voters', gender wasn't the predominant issue for swing state voters in general. I don't think that neopronouns are a big issue outside of hypothetical arguments on the internet. You can certainly link neopronouns to a broader issue that people care about. But this thread was just about neopronouns (starting from your question "What about neopronouns?") before you brought Trump into it!
wat10000 2y ago
I already have to remember people’s names, what’s the difference?

What about neopronouns? Can someone just make up a new set of words like zi / zim / zis and expect you to remember them whenever talking to or about that person?

djur 2y ago

You already remember what standard pronouns to use to refer to each person in your life. They're words you learned right from the start of learning the language. The same isn't true of "neopronouns".

crackercrews 2y ago
You seem to be in agreement with my sentiment. There is also additional work in remembering which pronoun to use with which NB person. With most people, you just automatically say the right thing.

foldr 2y ago

What have you done so far in cases where a coworker has asked you to refer to them only using a neopronoun?

crackercrews 2y ago
As others have suggested I just avoid pronouns. This seems to be a common approach.
- foldr 2y ago
  Seems like a practical solution. So what’s the problem?
  - crackercrews 2y ago
    Probably that gender ideology played a sizable role in getting Trump re-elected. It was the topic of his most popular ad, and IIRC the plurality of swing state voters said it was the most important issue for them. So getting people to use preferred pronouns was a bit of a Pyrrhic victory in my book.
    - foldr 2y ago
      >IIRC the plurality of swing state voters said [gender ideology] was the most important issue for them. I don't think that you RC. Citation very much needed here. The issue of neopronouns is largely theoretical, since almost all users of neopronouns also accept the gender neutral 'they'. The Trump ads weren't about neopronouns, and I doubt that most Trump voters (or indeed most Democratic voters) could tell you what a neopronoun is. Using people's preferred pronouns out of he/she/they is just common courtesy. It's essentially what everyone, social conservatives included, already does whenever they take someone's word regarding their gender rather than looking down their pants before talking about them in the third person.
      - crackercrews 2y ago
        Eh, ok. [1] I guess there must be another reason Trump's campaign spent hundreds of millions of dollars broadcasting that ad. It was way more than they spent on any other ad. You're moving the goalpost here and pretending that neopronouns is not that big an issue. But it's obviously just part of the gender ideology issue, which was clearly part of the reason Trump won. I can see that there are still people out there with their heads in the sand. I wonder who you'll help elect next time around? 1: https://www.megynkelly.com/2024/11/11/survey-finds-trans-issue-was-top-concern-for-swing-voters-in-2024/ https://www.megynkelly.com/2024/11/11/survey-finds-trans-iss...
        foldr 2y ago
        You said ‘swing state voters’. The survey you indirectly link to is talking about ‘swing voters’: >Our definition of swing voters includes those who are undecided in the presidential race, have changed their voting preference since 2020 (voting Democrat in one election and Republican in the other), or are independents who either indicate they split their votes between Democrats and Republicans, or who hold either favorable or unfavorable views of both Trump and Harris. The sample of voters is weighted towards swing states, but judging by the numbers for 'All voters', gender wasn't the predominant issue for swing state voters in general. I don't think that neopronouns are a big issue outside of hypothetical arguments on the internet. You can certainly link neopronouns to a broader issue that people care about. But this thread was just about neopronouns (starting from your question "What about neopronouns?") before you brought Trump into it!

wat10000 2y ago

I already have to remember people’s names, what’s the difference?