4 ms·

> If anything, this TikTok ban is actually making things more equal, if only by a tiny bit. I do t use tiktok and have no skin in the game as an EU resident, b

> If anything, this TikTok ban is actually making things more equal, if only by a tiny bit. I do t use tiktok and have no skin in the game as an EU resident, but setting a precedent for this kind of behaviour to permit clthe government to simply block anything it wants is basically following in CCPs footsteps, that's certainly not a good thing in my eyes.

kelnos 2y ago
This is not a new precedent. The US government has placed foreign-ownership restrictions on media companies since before the public internet was a thing. The only difference here is that it's targeted at a specific company, but I'm not really up in arms about that, even though I think they definitely could have written the law without naming ByteDance or TikTok specifically.
- themaninthedark 2y ago
  Not just media companies, the government block a Japanese company from buying US Steel. Not out of antitrust concerns but due to the foreign ownership aspect.
  - xp84 2y ago
    Yup, and that was done against one of our most loyal allies.
- xcrunner529 2y ago
  Yep, but people don't pay attention to history anymore and their ignorance keeps us repeating it.
  - j33zusjuice 2y ago
    Did they ever?
    - xcrunner529 2y ago
      I think more people in government did because they actually were educated and not just all grifters.
HenryBemis 2y ago
Numerous examples of China-says-jump-everyone-says-how-high. NBA, any company that makes anything within China using slavery, the guy/actor/wrestler (the name escapes me right now) who had to learn Chinese to apologize. Take your pick of "precedent". 1bn customers = a lot of money. A company that will kiss the ring will do the right thing by its shareholders and a nasty thing against humanity. I am 200% sure that Apple has given the keys for all users/phones/servers in China to the gov/CCP and nobody complained. If North Korea had 1bn potential customers, we would be seeing Kim very differently. We are cattle. It's all a 1984-ish sham. Historically China has been so large and 'diverse' (not to be confused with DEI) (like India and Russia). It's not "one chinese person is just like anyone else". There are multiple Republics/States/etc. It takes an emperor to keep together an empire. And that usually requires (plenty of) violence. Communism is built to make people suffer, remove individuality and requires total obedience and personal reformation to be the 'good citizen'. You and me both are EU citizens. We are all different and we respect/accept each other. In China if you disagree, you disappear. They would very much like to do the same to the rest of the world. And one day they will, just not yet. I hope they implode before they do (like all empires). (apologies for the grim tone)(I suggest "Principles for Dealing with the Changing World Order by Ray Dalio": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xguam0TKMw8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xguam0TKMw8)
- throw0101c 2y ago
  > NBA, any company that makes anything within China using slavery, the guy/actor/wrestler (the name escapes me right now) who had to learn Chinese to apologize. Take your pick of "precedent". Houston Rockets GM and James Harden: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Harden#Politics https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Harden#Politics * https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/general-news/nbas-apology-china-draws-outrage-political-spectrum-1245772/ https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/general-news/nbas-apo... * https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/27787634/james-harden-apologizes-controversy-grows-love-china https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/27787634/james-harden-ap...
  - Thorrez 2y ago
    John Cena was probably the wrestler HenryBemis was referring to. Although he started learning Chinese a long time ago, not for the purpose of apologizing. A couple years ago he called Taiwan a country, then issued an apology. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/may/26/john-cena-very-sorry-for-saying-taiwan-is-a-country https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/may/26/john-cena-very...
yyyfb 2y ago
As an EU resident your govt likely exerts far more control over media (both domestic and foreign owned) than the US
- bilekas 2y ago
  > As an EU resident your govt likely exerts far more control over media (both domestic and foreign owned) than the US Wild statement, so lets look at some data. https://fr.statista.com/statistiques/1337388/classement-pays-europe-indice-de-liberte-de-la-presse/ https://fr.statista.com/statistiques/1337388/classement-pays... These are a list of the freedom of press in the EU with their corresponding indexes. Lets compare that to the US : https://rsf.org/en/country/united-states https://rsf.org/en/country/united-states Index 2024 Score : 66.59 Not looking good for your opinion but lets look at some more that are consumer privacy focused, which was my main point. https://iapp.org/resources/article/countries-at-a-glance-privacy-and-consumer-trust/ https://iapp.org/resources/article/countries-at-a-glance-pri... IAPP isn't a bad source IMO but hard to evaluate their methods, but lets see. > Level of understanding about data collection and use Netherlands : Weak - 14% USA : Weak - 24% Not great, I could spend time finding more, but the summary is that the EU has regulations that require companies to limit the useage of consumers information and privacy. The EU is consumer privacy focused, wheras the US seems to be Enterprise & Organisation focused, also it's state level enforcements fracture enforcement even further. Lets look at the US CCPA vs GDPR : A crucial difference is that GDPR requires individuals to opt-in before businesses can collect data while there is no opt-in condition in CCPA. That should say it all. Edit : I forgot to add, outside of Sanctions the EU has no control to simply decide to ban a company when it feels like it.
  - RHSeeger 2y ago
    You start off sounding like you're arguing against the idea that the EU exerts more control over media than the US, but then most of what you said seems to support the fact that they do so. Am I misreading what your intent?
    - bilekas 2y ago
mrighele 2y ago
After the invasion of Ukraine, the EU blocked a number of outlets for spreading pro-Russian disinformation (RT, Sputnik for example) so this would be nothing new.
mystified5016 2y ago
Ah, but you see, pigs are in fact more equal than other animals
xp84 2y ago
I feel like takes like these are coming from a place of extreme naivete, or worse, nihilism. Either people don't understand why it's problematic that our most influential social media platform among basically everyone age 0-30 is fully controlled by the CCP, or people really think the CCP wouldn't use its ability to control any Chinese company to aggressively mold US public opinion in concert with their inevitable invasion of the democratic country Taiwan, or... the nihilistic option: People know China would engage in information warfare using TikTok in a situation like that, but they foolishly think the CCP is on even moral ground with free democracies so none of this matters, and we've gotta keep the funny musical memes flowing. For all one's misgivings about the US -- and there are many valid ones! -- before deciding these governments are equal, talk to a Chinese political dissident, if you can find one, since they sometimes disappear.

kelnos 2y ago

This is not a new precedent. The US government has placed foreign-ownership restrictions on media companies since before the public internet was a thing. The only difference here is that it's targeted at a specific company, but I'm not really up in arms about that, even though I think they definitely could have written the law without naming ByteDance or TikTok specifically.

themaninthedark 2y ago
Not just media companies, the government block a Japanese company from buying US Steel. Not out of antitrust concerns but due to the foreign ownership aspect.
- xp84 2y ago
  Yup, and that was done against one of our most loyal allies.
xcrunner529 2y ago
Yep, but people don't pay attention to history anymore and their ignorance keeps us repeating it.
- j33zusjuice 2y ago
  Did they ever?
  - xcrunner529 2y ago
    I think more people in government did because they actually were educated and not just all grifters.

HenryBemis 2y ago

Numerous examples of China-says-jump-everyone-says-how-high. NBA, any company that makes anything within China using slavery, the guy/actor/wrestler (the name escapes me right now) who had to learn Chinese to apologize. Take your pick of "precedent". 1bn customers = a lot of money. A company that will kiss the ring will do the right thing by its shareholders and a nasty thing against humanity. I am 200% sure that Apple has given the keys for all users/phones/servers in China to the gov/CCP and nobody complained. If North Korea had 1bn potential customers, we would be seeing Kim very differently. We are cattle. It's all a 1984-ish sham. Historically China has been so large and 'diverse' (not to be confused with DEI) (like India and Russia). It's not "one chinese person is just like anyone else". There are multiple Republics/States/etc. It takes an emperor to keep together an empire. And that usually requires (plenty of) violence. Communism is built to make people suffer, remove individuality and requires total obedience and personal reformation to be the 'good citizen'. You and me both are EU citizens. We are all different and we respect/accept each other. In China if you disagree, you disappear. They would very much like to do the same to the rest of the world. And one day they will, just not yet. I hope they implode before they do (like all empires). (apologies for the grim tone)(I suggest "Principles for Dealing with the Changing World Order by Ray Dalio": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xguam0TKMw8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xguam0TKMw8)

throw0101c 2y ago
> NBA, any company that makes anything within China using slavery, the guy/actor/wrestler (the name escapes me right now) who had to learn Chinese to apologize. Take your pick of "precedent". Houston Rockets GM and James Harden: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Harden#Politics https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Harden#Politics * https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/general-news/nbas-apology-china-draws-outrage-political-spectrum-1245772/ https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/general-news/nbas-apo... * https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/27787634/james-harden-apologizes-controversy-grows-love-china https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/27787634/james-harden-ap...
- Thorrez 2y ago
  John Cena was probably the wrestler HenryBemis was referring to. Although he started learning Chinese a long time ago, not for the purpose of apologizing. A couple years ago he called Taiwan a country, then issued an apology. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/may/26/john-cena-very-sorry-for-saying-taiwan-is-a-country https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/may/26/john-cena-very...

yyyfb 2y ago

As an EU resident your govt likely exerts far more control over media (both domestic and foreign owned) than the US

bilekas 2y ago
> As an EU resident your govt likely exerts far more control over media (both domestic and foreign owned) than the US Wild statement, so lets look at some data. https://fr.statista.com/statistiques/1337388/classement-pays-europe-indice-de-liberte-de-la-presse/ https://fr.statista.com/statistiques/1337388/classement-pays... These are a list of the freedom of press in the EU with their corresponding indexes. Lets compare that to the US : https://rsf.org/en/country/united-states https://rsf.org/en/country/united-states Index 2024 Score : 66.59 Not looking good for your opinion but lets look at some more that are consumer privacy focused, which was my main point. https://iapp.org/resources/article/countries-at-a-glance-privacy-and-consumer-trust/ https://iapp.org/resources/article/countries-at-a-glance-pri... IAPP isn't a bad source IMO but hard to evaluate their methods, but lets see. > Level of understanding about data collection and use Netherlands : Weak - 14% USA : Weak - 24% Not great, I could spend time finding more, but the summary is that the EU has regulations that require companies to limit the useage of consumers information and privacy. The EU is consumer privacy focused, wheras the US seems to be Enterprise & Organisation focused, also it's state level enforcements fracture enforcement even further. Lets look at the US CCPA vs GDPR : A crucial difference is that GDPR requires individuals to opt-in before businesses can collect data while there is no opt-in condition in CCPA. That should say it all. Edit : I forgot to add, outside of Sanctions the EU has no control to simply decide to ban a company when it feels like it.
- RHSeeger 2y ago
  You start off sounding like you're arguing against the idea that the EU exerts more control over media than the US, but then most of what you said seems to support the fact that they do so. Am I misreading what your intent?
  - bilekas 2y ago

mrighele 2y ago

After the invasion of Ukraine, the EU blocked a number of outlets for spreading pro-Russian disinformation (RT, Sputnik for example) so this would be nothing new.

mystified5016 2y ago

Ah, but you see, pigs are in fact more equal than other animals

xp84 2y ago

I feel like takes like these are coming from a place of extreme naivete, or worse, nihilism. Either people don't understand why it's problematic that our most influential social media platform among basically everyone age 0-30 is fully controlled by the CCP, or people really think the CCP wouldn't use its ability to control any Chinese company to aggressively mold US public opinion in concert with their inevitable invasion of the democratic country Taiwan, or... the nihilistic option: People know China would engage in information warfare using TikTok in a situation like that, but they foolishly think the CCP is on even moral ground with free democracies so none of this matters, and we've gotta keep the funny musical memes flowing. For all one's misgivings about the US -- and there are many valid ones! -- before deciding these governments are equal, talk to a Chinese political dissident, if you can find one, since they sometimes disappear.