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Man, the current democratic party just does not know how to solve problems in a way that people appreciate. Absurd that the Republicans are somehow going to sw
by spicyusername 2y ago
Man, the current democratic party just does not know how to solve problems in a way that people appreciate.
Absurd that the Republicans are somehow going to swoop in and "Save the day" on an issue they themselves championed.
- dataflow 2y ago> Man, the current democratic party just does not know how to solve problems in a way that people appreciate. What would have been a solution to the problem that people would have appreciated?
- silvestrov 2y agoPublish the algorithm. Allow users to choose which algorithm they want to use.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- Hatrix 2y agoFacebook?
- undersuit 2y agoYeah you can choose to use Facebook, Instagram, Whatsapp, or Threads freely. /s
- hackyhacky 2y agoWhat does this even mean? There is no "algorithm": the policies of a service like Tiktok are spread throughout its entirety. The only meaningful way to "release the algorithm" would be to release the whole source code. Furthermore, releasing the source code wouldn't help, since regular people aren't able to understand what it means; and there is no way to verify that the released source code corresponds to what is actually being run. It would be great if there was some way to verify that a service you're using matches some published code, but we don't have that.
- Aachen 2y ago> Furthermore, releasing the source code wouldn't help, since regular people aren't able to understand what it means Releasing the code does help. Joe can't open up his car and fix the engine control code, but the local repair shop can and they can also understand it and raise to a journalist "huh this manufacturer pushed a new version that'll make it stop driving if you service it at the workshop of a competitor" or whatever the car equivalent of this tiktok algorithm concern would be The second problem you mention, I fully agree with: verifying whatever they publish. Client source code, you barely even need because it'll just be a front end for what the servers decide to show you. Verifying that what they say the server code is, is really what the server runs, that's the hard bit. But claiming to be open could be a start; something we can find discrepancies in and push for further openness Whether this will solve the national security concerns and help with the youth mental health crisis that's often linked to social media, that's all way beyond my expertise and I have no opinion on the matter. Just that, in general, not everyone needs to understand everything in the world for it to be useful to publish
- dluan 2y agoThe code has been available for years. Bytedance published their recommendation engine as an arxiv paper in 2021 and the code is available on Github, https://github.com/bytedance/monolith https://github.com/bytedance/monolith. The power is in the weights of the live-trained model.
- braiamp 2y agoA privacy law, for starters.
- mfost 2y agoAs if that would even have any effect in that situation. No amount of audits and rules would prevent TikTok from collecting data and manipulating the public opinion.
- dns_snek 2y agoWhy not monitor it? Create thousands of read-only accounts that "prefer" content with all kinds of ideological viewpoints and statistically analyze whether the algorithm is being biased to promote certain viewpoints. I'm not smart enough to implement something like that but it sounds like a solvable problem to me.
- accrual 2y agoI thought about this too. In no way do I suggest it's an actual solution, but I wonder if some kind of reporting could be used as leverage to help appease US leaders towards a solution that doesn't require banning the app or handing it over to them.
- metabagel 2y agoHow does that prevent China from using TikTok to inject malware?
- jackson1442 2y ago[ citation needed ]
- metabagel 2y agoI don't think I need a citation to say that it's feasible for China to inject malware via the TikTok app on people's phones. Would it be difficult? I imagine so. But, I think the risk is such that the onus is to prove that it's not possible, not the other way around. China is a hostile power and an authoritarian regime. It's a different risk calculus than Facebook, which is not controlled by a dangerous foreign adversary.
- rayiner 2y agoMy 12 year old daughter was cranky this morning about Tik Tok being banned, then walked in ecstatic it was working again. I’m like “I wonder if Trump fixed Tik Tok,” and sure enough. She gave me a high five. My 6 year old son is already MAGA because the boys in his class love Trump. Like inflation, this was a problem Trump created and now he’s getting credit for fixing it.
- quenix 2y agoIt's probably not a good idea to let a 12 year old use tiktok.
- qup 2y agoBetter tell every parent in America
- LAC-Tech 2y agodo you not remember being 12?
- rayiner 2y agoShe watches videos about ancient Egypt, her friends lip syncing to songs, and knitting. The content on Tik Tok is way better than the trash on network TV or Hollywood movies. I consider the Chinese oversight a plus. It’s much more sensitive to Asian values for the most part.
- wordofx 2y agoThere are no “Asian values” on TikTok. TikTok is banned in China. If it had values your 12yo wouldn’t be on it as Douyin has an age restriction of 18+, and prenatal consent if 13-17. Under 13 is prohibited. It also has time restriction of 40 minutes per day for 13-14yo and only accessible between 6am till 10pm. Not only that content is highly censored and restricted. But keep living in a bubble that TikTok is totally fine.
- userbinator 2y ago
- ronnier 2y agoI’m just happy TikTok is back. It’s a big loss for Reddit
- ruune 2y agoAm I missing something? How? The users would've went to Meta or Google I assume
- qwerpy 2y agoThe less people get sucked into the toxic Reddit bubble, the better.
- saturn8601 2y agoReddit is a lost cause. They totally got the election wrong and the day afterwards they broke their mind trying to justify the loss with whatever conspiracy theory they could come up with. Combine that with overzealous mods and you'll eventually end up in a situation where the majority of people left are just bots. Bots talking to other bots.
- echoangle 2y agoYou can’t talk like this about a platform based on the concept of independent Subforums. How did the Woodworking subreddit get the election wrong?
- 2y ago
- phillipcarter 2y ago[flagged]
- vasco 2y agoMr. Chew, does TikTok access the home wifi network?
- j0057 2y agoThat confused question was asked by representative Richard Hudson, R-NC.
- vasco 2y agoWhich is why it is an appropriate response to someone who thinks geriatric politicians are only on one side of the aisle.
- Nimitz14 2y agoWithout more context it sounds like you're quoting an old democratic politician. Obviously.
- qwerty2000 2y ago[dead]
- sureglymop 2y agoNot necessarily a bad question. Could be interpreted as "does this app actively scan for other devices in the home network?".
- 83457 2y agoI thought that was what was meant by the question. Was it not?
- 2y ago
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- markus_zhang 2y agoWhat do they, or any elite gain/lose by gaining/losing the appreciation of ordinary people. Do you care what a cattle or a sheep thinks? Some may, but the majority don't give it a shit.
- groggo 2y agoThey do still need our votes. But they forgot that, so they lost. I voted for democrats but they got what they deserved.
- judahmeek 2y agoWhat exactly do you think Democrats should have done that they didn't do?
- steveBK123 2y agoI vote democrat, but then I'm a rich, educated, knowledge worker coastal urban elite so I'm supposed to right? I think the hard answer is - the Dems need to actually do things that dissatisfy people like me if they want to actually win the masses - working class, blue collar, etc voter back. Currently they are focussed on everything other than class. Identity politics. Race, gender, sexuality, immigration status, etc. None of this is particularly threatening to people like me and is a moral good, but it should be secondary to actually helping the poor regardless of how they identify. Left wing parties elsewhere push for more redistributive policies than the Dems ever dream of here. Instead they do hand-outs to constituencies that aren't in dire need, and already vote Dem anyway. Student loan forgiveness, EV tax credits, etc. Meanwhile in UK & EU, even the vaguely upper end of middle class pay marginal tax rates that would make $1M/year US earners cry. This is where the revenue comes for the depth & breadth of their social programs. Should the US go that far? Absolutely not. It would stifle innovation, growth, and what makes the US far more successful than our rich peers. But Dems need to break free of the thinking that if we just tax a few billionaires, all our problems will be solved.
- 2y ago
- lm28469 2y agoWhen the "real problems" are TikTok access and who can enter in which public bathroom you know everyone loses, panem et circenses
- thomassmith65 2y agoBut TikTik is an important forum for the people of the world to solve our thorny issues! In the days before social media, our world was a mess. Today we are awash in sage, well-reasoned discourse: a new Age of Enlightenment! What fools we'd be to tinker with this valuable information ecosystem. /s
- logicchains 2y ago[flagged]
- lm28469 2y agoThat's good, we should also tell them about bad things done by other countries/civilizations. Because until then it's extremely weird how it only focuses on destabilizing and demoralizing countries internally
- accrual 2y agoAnd there are some news about protests in other countries on the app, I've received some in my feed. I agree it's important to have a global understanding of events in the world. The focus on US instability in the US feeds make sense to me though, people want to be able to have a say and encourage action in their local areas.
- gdhkgdhkvff 2y agoYounger generations being anti-war is a tale as old as time. Unrelated to the current “TikTok-fed generation”. Meaning TikTok isn’t making them enlightened, that’s just how younger people always are.
- erentz 2y agoLooking this up, is this [1] the bill? Cuz it turns out this bill was sponsored by a Republican and passed during a Republican controlled House in 2023, by a supermajority 352 - 65. People always blame Democrats for things that Republicans do. [1] https://www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/house-bill/7521/all-actions?overview=closed&q=%7B%22roll-call-vote%22%3A%22all%22%7D https://www.congress.gov/bill/118th-congress/house-bill/7521...
- ok123456 2y agoAIPAC made sure it had bipartisan support.
- starik36 2y agoThere is always someone in the thread who wants to blame the Jews. Two in this one.
- ok123456 2y agoThere are many Jews who disagree with what AIPAC does in the country and what Israel does. Would we permit a lobby for China to do the same thing?
- starik36 2y agoBecause AIPAC is an American organization made up of American citizens funded by American citizens.
- GordonS 2y agoAnd there is always a Hasbara drone who lies, deflects, and conflates Israel with Jewry so they can insinuate that any criticism of Israel == antisemitism.
- bitcurious 2y agoAIPAC is an organization made up of American Jews, not Israelis.
- divbzero 2y agoThe outgoing Biden administration actually stated that they wouldn’t enforce the ban for just one day, choosing to leave implementation of the law to the incoming Trump administration. Efforts to save TikTok have been bipartisan (“Senate Democratic Leader Chuck Schumer said he spoke with Biden on Thursday to advocate for extending the deadline to ban TikTok.”) and efforts to enforce the ban have also been bipartisan (“Democrats had tried on Wednesday to pass legislation that would have extended the deadline, but Republican Sen. Tom Cotton of Arkansas blocked it. Cotton, chair of the Senate Intelligence Committee, said that TikTok has had ample time to find a buyer.”) https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/biden-wont-enforce-tiktok-ban-leaving-fate-of-app-to-trump-official-says https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/biden-wont-enforce-tik...
- Gormo 2y agoThe incentive structures inherent in modern politics encourages all politicians to alternately champion or repudiate unworkable solutions to problems that themselves are likely exaggerated or fabricated from whole cloth. The parties are just brands competing against each other to appeal to different segments of the same market, offering essentially the same product in different packaging. Getting your competitor to adopt a market position that you've already prepared a response to is a neat trick. This is par for the course, and I don't understand why anyone would expect anything different.
- matthewmacleod 2y agoThis just seems trivially obviously not true to me.
- Gormo 2y agoI mean, it seems obviously true to me, which is why I posited it here. Do you have a counter-argument you'd like to offer in response?
- jimmydoe 2y agoDEM looks bad now bc they just lost power. DEM did not solve it earlier bc an unpopular party can't do hard/unpopular things. GOP may have a shot, if they will be as popular as they looked in November. End of day it's about popularity and power.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- nfw2 2y agoIt seems like an oversight to me that all the discussion about political impact leading up to this has focused on consumers. Statements like "Gen Z likes TikTok, so banning it risks alienating them", "Gen Z will forgot about TikTok and move on to the next thing in due time", etc. I think this overlooks one key detail. The focal points of the new online world -- "influencers" -- rely on TikTok for the lion's share of their income. Taking away a fun toy might not radicalize someone but taking away their livelihood might. And even if these users are a tiny fraction of a percent, they wield outsized influence (obviously). They are the new media. Risking losing these people, many of whom have been largely apolitical, seems like a huge tactical error in retrospect, and one that Trump would predictably take advantage of if given the chance.
- TrackerFF 2y agoTrump was banging the drum regarding banning TikTok, then changes his tune in the 11th hour, and will now use this to come out as the hero and savior. Not to mention how many republicans supported this.
- portaouflop 2y agoI gotta hand it to him it’s kind of genius
- Aachen 2y agoBut also scary how much people are willing to swallow Edit: wanted to elaborate but wasn't sure how to put it best. Then two comments down there is exactly what I'm looking for: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42759761 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42759761 So many people (in absolute numbers at least, maybe not in relative numbers) seem to just eat it up like kids eat candy
- fnimick 2y agoAnecdotal, but I see a ton of people who were anti-trump and protesting just a couple years ago celebrating and thanking Trump for saving tiktok and making them happy again. It's wild. If someone banned youtube or HN, I'd be upset, but I wouldn't be depressed and suicidal over it like some of these people were publicly
- colechristensen 2y agoThe bill was cosponsored by 54, 32 of them were Republicans. I think the primary author was a Republican.
- xienze 2y ago> Absurd that the Republicans are somehow going to swoop in and "Save the day" on an issue they themselves championed. Absurd that when Trump initially proposed this it was considered a stupid and racist idea. Now they’re for it.
- gnkyfrg 2y ago[dead]