23 ms·

It's useless. It's a relic from an era when trackpads weren't good. I'm glad they got rid of it. It's just not needed anymore and the left/right click button s

It's useless. It's a relic from an era when trackpads weren't good. I'm glad they got rid of it. It's just not needed anymore and the left/right click button space can be used to make the trackpad larger.

TravHatesMe 2y ago
Speak for yourself. I'm typing on a thinkpad at the moment, I use the trackpoint all the time. Once you've mastered it, you no longer need to move your hands between typing / moving the mouse. Your fingers stay on the keyboard.
sho_hn 2y ago
Not sure, I think this is a bit daft from a marketing POV. It was an iconic, recognizable differentiator, and is the sort of thing that makes people tell the story of your brand. Other brands would kill to have a legacy, especially in a space where the product is otherwise largely interchangable and just passes through whatever the latest Intel/AMD product is. It's like Mercedes deciding not to remind you of the Gullwing every 5 minutes anymore. If I was working at Dell, I would be flabbergasted at my competitor just throwing away one of their little advantages. Lenovo already has other brands catering to folks who don't identify with the ThinkPad brand identity and aesthetic (e.g. the Yoga devices, where some of the premium models have been legit svelte and gorgeous; I bought my mom in law a swanky Yoga with an OLED and it's more lovely than anything Apple).
- lordofgibbons 2y ago
  They're still keeping the trackpoint in all of their existing models. This is just for a new thinkpad model.
- mmooss 2y ago
  > It was an iconic, recognizable differentiator, and is the sort of thing that makes people tell the story of your brand. Other brands would kill to have a legacy, especially in a space where the product is otherwise largely interchangable ... > If I was working at Dell, I would be flabbergasted at my competitor just throwing away one of their little advantages. That was my thinking. Why would you give away what distinguishes you and gives you an identity - one with an American, Western connection - and become just another laptop company? Why buy Lenovo now? I read a story about Apple when they fired Steve Jobs. The new management did what everyone had been pushing for years: License the OS to other manufacturers, and start shifting to PC-compatible hardware. Pretty soon, Macs went from a single physical unit with a handle on top for carrying, to a CPU box and separate CRT monitor, available from multiple brands. But then why buy a Mac, with it's broadly incompatible OS and higher price? The marketing genius of the crowds was, of course, incompetent. When Steve Jobs came back he killed the licensing of the OS and immediately put out a fun, high-design, single-unit cheap desktop computer. Edit: On the other hand, maybe Lenovo is smart. There can be a big controversy, lots of people talking about Lenovo, and then they can go back and forth a bit and finally put back the trackpoint.
- mrandish 2y ago
  > I think this is a bit daft from a marketing POV. I agree. It's dumb and seemingly incomprehensible but I finally understood why it happens after seeing it occur inside a large company with a long-successful product line with well-known signature traits. When a product and it's major features are successful enough to last literally decades, they outlive the careers of product managers, designers and marketers. Over time new people come in and work their up into positions of influence. Many times they are there because they appreciate (or even revere) the product, but they're also anxious to put their own mark on the legacy. This isn't just self-centered, they often view their role as bearing the responsibility to guide the legendary product's journey into the future. At the same time, they didn't inherit complete knowledge of all the reasons why things got the way they are or all the things which were tried in the past. There's also the ever-present ambient need in any organization to "do things" significant enough to justify their, now senior, role along with promotions and bonuses. It's ultimately just a combination of common human behavior in the context of large, long-lasting organizations. I see it so many places in the tech I use daily - Windows is a good example as is Firefox. The current product managers and designers seem to always be removing or fucking up some lower profile but essential feature a subset of users rely on that had been good for a decade or more. Of course, understanding it doesn't excuse that it's dumb and shouldn't happen.
legitster 2y ago
I still use it when coding or writing. You can really easily move the cursor and never take your fingers off the keyboard.
- marssaxman 2y ago
  I really like to use it for drag & drop, too - it somehow feels much more precise than the trackpad.
Zak 2y ago
As a long-time Thinkpad user, I disagree. I even have a Trackpoint keyboard for my desktop because being able to do mouse things without moving my hands from the keyboard's home row is a huge convenience. It was the deciding factor between another Thinkpad and a Framework last time I bought a laptop.
- commoner 2y ago
  It's a shame that Framework hasn't managed to implement a pointing stick on its laptops. If they offered one, I would already be using their laptops. The Framework feature request is here: https://community.frame.work/t/responded-any-chance-of-trackpoint/1026 https://community.frame.work/t/responded-any-chance-of-track...
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- fwip 2y ago
  I often use my thumb on the touchpad, but doing it now it does seem like I usually move my index finger a bit off home row. This is on a MacBook, where the top of the touchpad is basically right under the spacebar.
  - Zak 2y ago
    I've tried that on some laptops. I do not find it to be a good replacement for the Trackpoint.
vardump 2y ago
I haven't seen any Windows/Linux laptops with a good trackpad. Apple seems to be unbeatable in this regard.
- mhitza 2y ago
  I only recently got a Thinkpad T14 for work and the trackpad is really only serviceable. I was surprised. [0] Especially because many years ago got a Dell Inspiron line laptop, and the trackpad on that feels great to me. [0] what's even more surprising is that in Ubuntu there's an extra package, that adds more configuration options for the Thinkpad trackpad, but even with that I couldn't really make it feel as pleasant as my old Dell.
marssaxman 2y ago
I use it pretty much every day! It's nice. I use the trackpad too, but each device has its strengths.

TravHatesMe 2y ago

Speak for yourself. I'm typing on a thinkpad at the moment, I use the trackpoint all the time. Once you've mastered it, you no longer need to move your hands between typing / moving the mouse. Your fingers stay on the keyboard.

sho_hn 2y ago

Not sure, I think this is a bit daft from a marketing POV. It was an iconic, recognizable differentiator, and is the sort of thing that makes people tell the story of your brand. Other brands would kill to have a legacy, especially in a space where the product is otherwise largely interchangable and just passes through whatever the latest Intel/AMD product is. It's like Mercedes deciding not to remind you of the Gullwing every 5 minutes anymore. If I was working at Dell, I would be flabbergasted at my competitor just throwing away one of their little advantages. Lenovo already has other brands catering to folks who don't identify with the ThinkPad brand identity and aesthetic (e.g. the Yoga devices, where some of the premium models have been legit svelte and gorgeous; I bought my mom in law a swanky Yoga with an OLED and it's more lovely than anything Apple).

lordofgibbons 2y ago
They're still keeping the trackpoint in all of their existing models. This is just for a new thinkpad model.
mmooss 2y ago
> It was an iconic, recognizable differentiator, and is the sort of thing that makes people tell the story of your brand. Other brands would kill to have a legacy, especially in a space where the product is otherwise largely interchangable ... > If I was working at Dell, I would be flabbergasted at my competitor just throwing away one of their little advantages. That was my thinking. Why would you give away what distinguishes you and gives you an identity - one with an American, Western connection - and become just another laptop company? Why buy Lenovo now? I read a story about Apple when they fired Steve Jobs. The new management did what everyone had been pushing for years: License the OS to other manufacturers, and start shifting to PC-compatible hardware. Pretty soon, Macs went from a single physical unit with a handle on top for carrying, to a CPU box and separate CRT monitor, available from multiple brands. But then why buy a Mac, with it's broadly incompatible OS and higher price? The marketing genius of the crowds was, of course, incompetent. When Steve Jobs came back he killed the licensing of the OS and immediately put out a fun, high-design, single-unit cheap desktop computer. Edit: On the other hand, maybe Lenovo is smart. There can be a big controversy, lots of people talking about Lenovo, and then they can go back and forth a bit and finally put back the trackpoint.
mrandish 2y ago
> I think this is a bit daft from a marketing POV. I agree. It's dumb and seemingly incomprehensible but I finally understood why it happens after seeing it occur inside a large company with a long-successful product line with well-known signature traits. When a product and it's major features are successful enough to last literally decades, they outlive the careers of product managers, designers and marketers. Over time new people come in and work their up into positions of influence. Many times they are there because they appreciate (or even revere) the product, but they're also anxious to put their own mark on the legacy. This isn't just self-centered, they often view their role as bearing the responsibility to guide the legendary product's journey into the future. At the same time, they didn't inherit complete knowledge of all the reasons why things got the way they are or all the things which were tried in the past. There's also the ever-present ambient need in any organization to "do things" significant enough to justify their, now senior, role along with promotions and bonuses. It's ultimately just a combination of common human behavior in the context of large, long-lasting organizations. I see it so many places in the tech I use daily - Windows is a good example as is Firefox. The current product managers and designers seem to always be removing or fucking up some lower profile but essential feature a subset of users rely on that had been good for a decade or more. Of course, understanding it doesn't excuse that it's dumb and shouldn't happen.

legitster 2y ago

I still use it when coding or writing. You can really easily move the cursor and never take your fingers off the keyboard.

marssaxman 2y ago
I really like to use it for drag & drop, too - it somehow feels much more precise than the trackpad.

Zak 2y ago

As a long-time Thinkpad user, I disagree. I even have a Trackpoint keyboard for my desktop because being able to do mouse things without moving my hands from the keyboard's home row is a huge convenience. It was the deciding factor between another Thinkpad and a Framework last time I bought a laptop.

commoner 2y ago
It's a shame that Framework hasn't managed to implement a pointing stick on its laptops. If they offered one, I would already be using their laptops. The Framework feature request is here: https://community.frame.work/t/responded-any-chance-of-trackpoint/1026 https://community.frame.work/t/responded-any-chance-of-track...
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
fwip 2y ago
I often use my thumb on the touchpad, but doing it now it does seem like I usually move my index finger a bit off home row. This is on a MacBook, where the top of the touchpad is basically right under the spacebar.
- Zak 2y ago
  I've tried that on some laptops. I do not find it to be a good replacement for the Trackpoint.

vardump 2y ago

I haven't seen any Windows/Linux laptops with a good trackpad. Apple seems to be unbeatable in this regard.

mhitza 2y ago
I only recently got a Thinkpad T14 for work and the trackpad is really only serviceable. I was surprised. [0] Especially because many years ago got a Dell Inspiron line laptop, and the trackpad on that feels great to me. [0] what's even more surprising is that in Ubuntu there's an extra package, that adds more configuration options for the Thinkpad trackpad, but even with that I couldn't really make it feel as pleasant as my old Dell.

marssaxman 2y ago

I use it pretty much every day! It's nice. I use the trackpad too, but each device has its strengths.