3 ms·

> first language? 1/3 of the global population is at all, there’s only 380 million native English speakers. US, UK, Canada, Australia is where you find the bu

by Retric 2y ago

> first language? 1/3 of the global population is at all, there’s only 380 million native English speakers. US, UK, Canada, Australia is where you find the bulk of native speakers. In say Germany or whatever they may become fluent but it’s relatively rare for German parents to be speaking English to each other in casual conversation next to an infant’s crib.

JumpCrisscross 2y ago
> there’s only 380 million native English speakers Not how a lingua franca works. There are 1.5 to 2 billion English speakers [1]. By far the largest number of people to speak a single language. Most of them are in America [2]. (If you count English learners, No. 2 is China [3].) [1] https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/english-today/article/two-thousand-million/68BFD87E5C867F7C3C47FD0749C7D417 https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/english-today/articl... [2] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/English-speaking_world https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/English-speaking_world [3] https://www.researchgate.net/publication/236986651_The_statistics_of_English_in_China https://www.researchgate.net/publication/236986651_The_stati...
- Retric 2y ago
  Being fluent is a different question, you can dream in English without it being your native language. first language = A first language (L1), native language, native tongue, or mother tongue is the first language a person has been exposed to from birth https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_language https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_language
  - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
    Yes, we understand what a first language is. You should understand why that’s irrelevant to this discussion.
    - lcnPylGDnU4H9OF 2y ago
      You know, they weren't the one to bring it up and their point seems to have consistently been that the majority of the global population does not speak English.
      - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
        Plurality of the world (25%) and a larger plurality of the internet-connected world (37%, [1]) speak English. (Granted, most of TikTok’s market now probably doesn’t speak English.) [1] https://www.itu.int/en/ITU-D/Statistics/pages/stat/default.aspx https://www.itu.int/en/ITU-D/Statistics/pages/stat/default.a...
        Retric 2y ago
        Which was my original comment…
        lcnPylGDnU4H9OF 2y ago
        > majority of the global population does not speak English > Plurality of the world ... speak English Sorry, what point are you trying to make?
      - lelanthran 2y ago
        > You know, they weren't the one to bring it up and their point seems to have consistently been that the majority of the global population does not speak English. While that has consistently been their point, it's also wrong. Their bar for "speaking English" is "Native Language". Absolutely no one uses that as a bar when talking about how many people can consume content in $LANGUAGE.
        lcnPylGDnU4H9OF 2y ago
        That is not their bar. Read this more carefully: > 1/3 of the global population is at all, there’s only 380 million native English speakers. 1/3 of the population speaks English “at all” (by which they mean speaking fluently, not learning) and 380 million people (roughly 5% of the population) is native. Not trying to throw shade at anyone but it’s really... not hard for a reader to pause a little when one reads something that sounds wrong; it’s possible the reader misread. It’s even in the guidelines under different words: > Please respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of what someone says, not a weaker one that's easier to criticize. Assume good faith. There was a lot of failure to follow to this guideline in this comment thread.
- ANewFormation 2y ago
  CIA gives 18.8%, so about 1.5 billion. [1] But this number is dubious as it's largely from self response. Here [2] is a list by country. So 25% of Thais, 50% of Ukrainians, 50% of Poles, and so on "speak English." In the sense of being able to say hello, thank you, and introduce themselves that is probably true. But "my name is Bob" maketh not a common tongue. If we narrowed it down to the percent of people that could hold a basic conversation, the number would plummet precipitously, likely leaving Mandarin at the top. [1] - https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=List_of_languages_by_total_number_of_speakers https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=List_of_languages... [2] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_English-speaking_population https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_English-s...
  - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
    > the number would plummet precipitously, likely leaving Mandarin at the top 70% of Chinese speak Mandarin as a first language [1]. > the sense of being able to say hello, thank you, and introduce themselves that is probably true This is English learners. If you count English learners, a third of Chinese speak English and a majority of the internet-connected world. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Languages_of_China https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Languages_of_China
    - ANewFormation 2y ago
      What I'm saying is that those are people counted as "knowing English" since the typical way such things are measured is self response. Nowhere remotely near the peecents stated for many countries is accurate. China's also been pushing Mandarin lately and claim 85%.
lelanthran 2y ago
>>> 2/3 of the global population doesn’t speak English. ... > there’s only 380 million native English speakers. So? Having only 1/3 of the planet speak English natively is not the same as 2/3 of the planet not speaking English at all.

by Retric 2y ago

JumpCrisscross 2y ago

> there’s only 380 million native English speakers Not how a lingua franca works. There are 1.5 to 2 billion English speakers [1]. By far the largest number of people to speak a single language. Most of them are in America [2]. (If you count English learners, No. 2 is China [3].) [1] https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/english-today/article/two-thousand-million/68BFD87E5C867F7C3C47FD0749C7D417 https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/english-today/articl... [2] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/English-speaking_world https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/English-speaking_world [3] https://www.researchgate.net/publication/236986651_The_statistics_of_English_in_China https://www.researchgate.net/publication/236986651_The_stati...

Retric 2y ago
Being fluent is a different question, you can dream in English without it being your native language. first language = A first language (L1), native language, native tongue, or mother tongue is the first language a person has been exposed to from birth https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_language https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_language
- JumpCrisscross 2y ago
  Yes, we understand what a first language is. You should understand why that’s irrelevant to this discussion.
  - lcnPylGDnU4H9OF 2y ago
    You know, they weren't the one to bring it up and their point seems to have consistently been that the majority of the global population does not speak English.
    - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
      Plurality of the world (25%) and a larger plurality of the internet-connected world (37%, [1]) speak English. (Granted, most of TikTok’s market now probably doesn’t speak English.) [1] https://www.itu.int/en/ITU-D/Statistics/pages/stat/default.aspx https://www.itu.int/en/ITU-D/Statistics/pages/stat/default.a...
      - Retric 2y ago
        Which was my original comment…
      - lcnPylGDnU4H9OF 2y ago
        > majority of the global population does not speak English > Plurality of the world ... speak English Sorry, what point are you trying to make?
    - lelanthran 2y ago
      > You know, they weren't the one to bring it up and their point seems to have consistently been that the majority of the global population does not speak English. While that has consistently been their point, it's also wrong. Their bar for "speaking English" is "Native Language". Absolutely no one uses that as a bar when talking about how many people can consume content in $LANGUAGE.
      - lcnPylGDnU4H9OF 2y ago
        That is not their bar. Read this more carefully: > 1/3 of the global population is at all, there’s only 380 million native English speakers. 1/3 of the population speaks English “at all” (by which they mean speaking fluently, not learning) and 380 million people (roughly 5% of the population) is native. Not trying to throw shade at anyone but it’s really... not hard for a reader to pause a little when one reads something that sounds wrong; it’s possible the reader misread. It’s even in the guidelines under different words: > Please respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of what someone says, not a weaker one that's easier to criticize. Assume good faith. There was a lot of failure to follow to this guideline in this comment thread.
ANewFormation 2y ago
CIA gives 18.8%, so about 1.5 billion. [1] But this number is dubious as it's largely from self response. Here [2] is a list by country. So 25% of Thais, 50% of Ukrainians, 50% of Poles, and so on "speak English." In the sense of being able to say hello, thank you, and introduce themselves that is probably true. But "my name is Bob" maketh not a common tongue. If we narrowed it down to the percent of people that could hold a basic conversation, the number would plummet precipitously, likely leaving Mandarin at the top. [1] - https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=List_of_languages_by_total_number_of_speakers https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=List_of_languages... [2] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_English-speaking_population https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_English-s...
- JumpCrisscross 2y ago
  > the number would plummet precipitously, likely leaving Mandarin at the top 70% of Chinese speak Mandarin as a first language [1]. > the sense of being able to say hello, thank you, and introduce themselves that is probably true This is English learners. If you count English learners, a third of Chinese speak English and a majority of the internet-connected world. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Languages_of_China https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Languages_of_China
  - ANewFormation 2y ago
    What I'm saying is that those are people counted as "knowing English" since the typical way such things are measured is self response. Nowhere remotely near the peecents stated for many countries is accurate. China's also been pushing Mandarin lately and claim 85%.

lelanthran 2y ago

>>> 2/3 of the global population doesn’t speak English. ... > there’s only 380 million native English speakers. So? Having only 1/3 of the planet speak English natively is not the same as 2/3 of the planet not speaking English at all.