5 ms·

It's the same from most things, I wonder why americans are ok with that mcdonalds fries: https://boingboing.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/McDonalds-French-Fri

• lovecg 2y ago
  I’m wondering, what are we seeing here? Actual difference in ingredients used, or a difference in regulations requiring listing all ingredients?
  • alchemist1e9 2y ago
    [flagged]
    • fnimick 2y ago
      I mean, he's still a nutcase. He can be right about some things for the wrong reasons. If you hit upon a scientifically accurate conclusion through an unrigorous process, basically by pure chance, this doesn't make you a good scientist.
      • alchemist1e9 2y ago
        Except he isn’t a nutcase. They twist his words incredibly. https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2025/01/14/los_angeles_times_owner_robert_f_kennedy_jr_knows_more_about_the_science_than_most_doctors.html https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2025/01/14/los_angel... So many people who opposed him and then take the time to understand what is actually saying, not what they have been told he is saying, come to realize he is completely sane. Bernie Sanders is on that list fwiw.
        • dpkirchner 2y ago
          The proof here seems to be an interview with someone (owner of the LA Times) who talked with RFK for a few hours came away believing he knows more than doctors. Is that right?
          • blindriver 2y ago
            Yes, the owner of the LA times is an actual doctor and transplant surgeon.
            • kstrauser 2y ago
              Ben Carson was a respected neurosurgeon before he publicly stated that, quote, "Joseph built the pyramids to store grain." You can be brilliant in one field and an idiot in everything else.
              • blindriver 2y ago
                I was talking about Dr. Patrick Soon-Shiong not Dr. Ben Carson. Care to show any evidence that Soon-Shiong is an idiot? Just because one doctor is stupid doesn't invalidate all doctors, does it? In that case, Dr. Ben Carson would be proof that Dr. Fauci is also an idiot.
                • kstrauser 2y ago
                  Of course not, but it highlights the risk of Appeal to Authority: one's expertise in a specific field does not make them experts in others, even ones adjacent to their own. For a more local example, I have a lot of experience writing Python. Someone outside the field might mistakenly think my opinions on, say, Java, are equally informed. They're not.
                  • blindriver 2y ago
                    Dr. Soon-Shiong was responsible for developing oncology drugs. Does that give him enough authority for him to evaluate RFK Jr's stance on drug safety? You haven't researched him at all, have you?
      • blindriver 2y ago
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        • HeatrayEnjoyer 2y ago
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          • blindriver 2y ago
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        • kstrauser 2y ago
          My wife's a doctor, and had patients begging her for leftover Vioxx samples after Merck pulled it from the market, preferring to take their chances with heart issues rather than living in agonizing pain that Vioxx was especially good at treating. Turns out medicine's complicated, who knew?
          • blindriver 2y ago
            Just because a drug works well doesn't mean that it's moral to release a drug that knowingly kills tens of thousands of people a year and then hide that data.
            • kstrauser 2y ago
              I agree. In my opinion, hiding the risk was the sin, not releasing the drug. Many, many people with chronic pain conditions would gladly accept the risk. It's kind of the same with any treatment: chemotherapy may make you incredibly sick before it saves you. Willow tree bark may fix your headache but cause you to bleed profusely. Homeopathy may make you die of whatever you were sick with before it cures your dehydration. Everything has its tradeoffs.
              • blindriver 2y ago
                We need to the full information in order to make our own choices. Right now pharma companies hide a lot of the information, including from clinical trials from drugs. All the data should be released and not hidden so that people can make their own choices on what medications they take and if they want to risk taking it, that's fine because they have all the information and they can make their own risk/reward judgement. Looks like you, me and RFK Jr. are perfectly aligned.
    • nozzlegear 2y ago
      Whoa, hold on. RFK may be right about this one thing in the same way a broken clock happens to occasionally be right, but let's not rush to take away his nutcase title. He has some truly messed up opinions about a variety of topics.
      • alchemist1e9 2y ago
        Like what? are you sure you understand his opinions? Many who finally talk to him directly who thought like you do find out maybe not so crazy. https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2025/01/14/los_angeles_times_owner_robert_f_kennedy_jr_knows_more_about_the_science_than_most_doctors.html https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2025/01/14/los_angel...
        • yakz 2y ago
          I fail to see how your link supports your questioning or your statement, could you explain it? It looks like it's just the opinion of the owner of the Los Angeles Times, a person that some might feel is heavily biased.
          • alchemist1e9 2y ago
            I’ll quote from another comment in this thread: > LA Times owner Dr. Patrick Soon-Shiong is a doctor and transplant surgeon and invented drugs to fight pancreatic and other forms of cancer. He ACTUALLY talked to RFK Jr. and after listening to him talk and what he had to say instead of relying on mainstream media propaganda, he changed his opinion on him.
        • HeatrayEnjoyer 2y ago
          RFK Jr is not a good person, is not a smart person, and we should not attempt to whitewash or legitimize him. He has a complex early life, but his actions today are his own choices. https://www.iheart.com/podcast/105-behind-the-bastards-29236323/episode/part-one-the-rfk-jr-episodes-198487913/ https://www.iheart.com/podcast/105-behind-the-bastards-29236...
    • klik99 2y ago
      Someone can be a nutcase but be right about some things. Also, seeing photo of him slurping up McDonald’s on the plane, guess healthy food isn’t the highest priority for him? Just the one he’s loudest about
      • s1artibartfast 2y ago
        Every time I see this, I don't get it. It only make sense as a "gotcha" if you believe in absolutist purity tests. He looks fit and healthy. Is there a video somewhere of him swearing on a bible that he will die before eating McDonalds?
        • alchemist1e9 2y ago
          Instead there are many videos of him talking about that McDonalds incident and how terrible Trump’s food choices are and he had nothing else to eat! Also there are memes from that picture of him grimacing and how frustrated he was.
        • klik99 2y ago
          Let me be more explicit about my point. I believe RFK genuinely wants to promote healthy living, and I agree with that. But Trump requires loyalty to be part of his inner circle and forcing RFK to eat mcds is getting RFK to prove that loyalty. RFK obviously hated eating that burger. My point is, if he’s willing to compromise his values for access to power does he really prioritize his values or does he prioritize access to power? No “gotcha”, I’m not a partisan. I don’t like Trump but there are a few things he’s done I like, but even with those I often don’t like HOW he did it. For example Greenland, I think that’s great for USs long term prospects (shipping routes), but to say military action is on the table is reckless. Not every criticism is a gotcha, and just because I disagree with 90% of what RFK believes doesn’t mean I don’t think his commitment to healthy eating is good. Maybe that you read a criticism as an absolute indictment of someone shows you have more purity tests than what you criticize. Hope someday you get it
          • s1artibartfast 2y ago
    • philistine 2y ago
      A broken clock is right once a day. RFK Jr. is not the nutcase we're told he is, he's a very slight different kind of nutcase that's just as bad because he mixes legitimate concerns with his absolutely insane point of view, and uses the same spurious arguments for both, muddying the water for everyone.
      • blindriver 2y ago
        What is insane?
        • philistine 2y ago
          His belief that vaccines cause autism.
          • blindriver 2y ago
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            • philistine 2y ago
              It's been throughly studied and debunked. Are you aware that there are countries other than the US where they have researched those claims?
              • blindriver 2y ago
                Are you against the FDA releasing all the data from the pharmaceutical companies so that others can conduct their own studies from full data? Right now every single head of the HHS, FDA and CDC want to protect pharma companies and let them hide all their data. RFK Jr. is the first candidate that isn't looking for a job in industry afterwards and wants to actually free the data for the sake of the American people. For that alone I think he should be head of HHS. As far as I've seen the only debunking has been done on single vaccines like MMR, not on the full schedule of vaccines. And it's a lie to say that they have been thoroughly debunked. Studies have shown that some vaccines can cause allergic reactions. Autistic children have over a 3X rate of food allergies or neurotypical children. Doesn't that warrant studying that maybe adjuvants are causing an immune response and the immune response causes autism?
    • dyauspitr 2y ago
      RFK Jr. is very wrong about some very important things and those already make him a dangerous nutcase.
      • alchemist1e9 2y ago
        You’re told he is wrong but I strongly suspect what you’re told he believes or says about those very important things is not what he actually does.
  • tomjakubowski 2y ago
    Yeah, take the Doritos as an example: the UK bag lists "Cheese Powder", the US bag lists "Cheddar Cheese" with sub-ingredients in parentheses (plus Whey and Skim Milk). What is in the UK Doritos' "Cool Original Flavour" (read: Ranch) ingredient? Maybe something like Tomato Powder, Onion Powder, Garlic Powder, Buttermilk, Natural and Artificial Flavors?
• thomspoon 2y ago
  I agree with you until you bring foodbabe into this. She’s notorious for hand-picking things that meet the MAHA agenda. For example, the oats argument, yes there is a ton of crap in the ultra processed Quaker oats, but that’s an old recipe. Here’s what they sell at target: https://www.target.com/p/quaker-fruit-38-cream-instant-oatmeal-variety-18ct/-/A-76884772 https://www.target.com/p/quaker-fruit-38-cream-instant-oatme... STRAWBERRIES & CREAM INGREDIENTS: Whole grain oats, sugar, dried strawberries, salt, dried cream, natural flavor, nonfat dry milk, sea salt, dried vegetable juice concentrate (color), tocopherols (to preserve freshness). There’s not always a one-to-one comparison, and I agree shady companies in the US have free rein over what crap they add to our foods, but this has already been debunked.
  • Retric 2y ago
    It wasn’t debunked, it worked. They changed the recipe after it received significant attention. Before then the company was happy to use food coloring on Apples to pretend it had strawberries while actually providing strawberries in another country. The thing is you can’t bring attention to every single product, which is the point of regulations around deceptive packaging.
  • arp242 2y ago
    > that’s an old recipe It's also an old image from 2019. What was the recipe like in 2019? (I don't know the answer, genuine question)
  • soared 2y ago
    One ingredient, oats. https://www.quakeroats.com/products/hot-cereals/old-fashioned-oats https://www.quakeroats.com/products/hot-cereals/old-fashione... I don’t know for sure but it looks like in the image the oh so simple is a different product line. Seemingly similar to all of Lays chips which come in normal and the healthier line.
• nozzlegear 2y ago
  As an oatmeal connoisseur, I'd be remiss not to point out that the two oatmeal products being compared there are not the same. The American product is specifically "Strawberries and Cream," which looks like it was deliberately picked because it adds a few extra scary-looking ingredients from the creaming agent; whereas the UK product is just "Heaps of Fruit," sans cream.
  • astura 2y ago
    Here's the American version of "heaps of fruit," "fruit fusion." https://www.walgreens.com/store/c/quaker-oats-instant-oatmeal-fruit-fusion-raspberry-strawberry/ID=300445357-product https://www.walgreens.com/store/c/quaker-oats-instant-oatmea... Ingredients Whole grain oats,sugar,dried raspberries,dried strawberries,natural flavor,tricalcium phosphate,salt,beet juice concentrate (color),iron,vitamin D2 (ergocalciferol). The American version is identical to the UK version until "natural flavor." The US version then adds some vitamins plus tricalcium phosphate, salt, and beet juice concentrate. The only "scary" ingredient is tricalcium phosphate, which appears to be an anti-caking agent. Edit: on Quaker's website https://www.quakeroats.com/products/hot-cereals/instant-oatmeal/fruit-fusion-raspberry-strawberry https://www.quakeroats.com/products/hot-cereals/instant-oatm... It says "Tricalcium Phosphate is a source of phosphorus that also provides the essential mineral calcium." Which is actually what I suspected, it's another added vitamin that has the benefit of also being an anti caking agent.
    • jacobgkau 2y ago
      Why does our version need an anti-caking agent when theirs doesn't? And why do we need to get calcium from checks notes oat meal (the non-cream version, mind you) when people in other countries can get it from things it's in naturally, like milk? There may be ostensible reasons why some of the extras we get are theoretically useful, but I'd still wonder why we're the only ones who go to all the trouble (when we don't seem to come out ahead for it, health-wise).
      • Aloisius 2y ago
        The UK versions all seem to have calcium phosphate in them too. https://www.britishcornershop.co.uk/quaker-oat-so-simple-heaps-of-fruit-banana-and-strawberry-pot https://www.britishcornershop.co.uk/quaker-oat-so-simple-hea... https://www.sainsburys.co.uk/gol-ui/product/quaker-oats-high-protein-strawberries-cream-porridge-pot-58g https://www.sainsburys.co.uk/gol-ui/product/quaker-oats-high... For some reason, the quaker oats uk website doesn't list it though, perhaps they're new formulations. I imagine it's used to keep the fine powders (powdered salt or milk powder depending on the product) from caking. If the previous version didn't have any salt, then it might not have needed it.
• rcpt 2y ago
  Protip: neither of those are oats.
  • Loveaway 2y ago
    protip: do not drink fanta, do not eat mcdonalds fries, do eat oats (but just buy real oats and throw in raspberrys or whatever), do not eat chips. Doesn't matter whether you are in the US or UK :)
• shusaku 2y ago
  Orange fanta is not really a good example because they are totally different flavored drinks. It’s less about chemical rules than the flavor design
• deaddodo 2y ago
  The McDonald's fries are the exact same ingredients, the FDA just requires more granular specifications which look "scary". Those are the bracketed "sub"-ingredients you see versus just "Vegetable Oil" for the other side. As to the additional anti-caking ingredient, I can't tell you. No idea if it's omitted from the UK side due to regulatory reasons or it's actually included but has no requirement to be listed, since it's included in a plethora of British foods in the same places that it's used in the US (things like powdered/confectioner's sugar): https://efsa.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.2903/j.efsa.2020.6107 https://efsa.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.2903/j.efsa.2020... Either way, it's not particularly nefarious (despite her scary red highlight added to it). As an aside, saying this as someone who's tried McDonald's in probably 60+ countries. It's all the same thing (except a few countries in Asia; Korea and Japan notably), especially like for like (Double Cheeseburger for Double Cheeseburger). I have no idea where this "European McDonald's is healthier/better" idea sprang up, outside of European superiority complexes (probably due to the need to self-justify how insanely busy McDonald's are in Europe). Especially in a country who's most famous takeaway item is overgreased fried chicken/fish and fries/chips tossed together in a bag, then covered and shaken in even more salt and condiments; possibly with a handful of cheese tossed on for good measure.
  • bsimpson 2y ago
    Also: canola oil is a rapeseed oil. You can imagine why a lot of people are more comfortable calling it "canola" than "rapeseed" (and hence why it's written that way on US packaging).
    • patmcc 2y ago
      Canola was also originally a trademark (name comes from "Canada oil low acid") - it's made from rapeseed that was specifically bred for low erucic acid. It definitely made it easier to market.
  • arcticbull 2y ago
    The "scary red" polydimethylsiloxane is in basically everything, and it's inert, non-toxic and non-flammable. It's permitted in the EU as E900. It's an anti-foaming agent used in trace quantities to prevent oil from splattering on the employees. There were no negative effects on rats at over 2g/kg. [1] [1] https://efsa.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.2903/j.efsa.2020.6107 https://efsa.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.2903/j.efsa.2020...
• arcticbull 2y ago
  Food Babe is a terrible source with an agenda. If you actually look at the safety profile of the things involved the differences are minimal. The real risk comes from all the sugar and simple carbs in both. - The fry ingredients are exactly the same, the US just requires more granular labelling. PDMS is used in oils in Europe too. Maybe in McDonalds oil maybe not, unclear. It's authorized for use in the EU as E900, and it is inert, non-toxic and non-flammable. It's added to stop the fryer oil from spraying on the employees. - Both Fantas are bad. - The oats are comparing two different products. 1/4 the label in the US is mandatory breakdowns not required in the UK. 1/4 of the label is the "creaming agent" (starch, whey protein, casein protein, some oil -- nothing a bodybuilder wouldn't consume) and 1/4 is the added vitamins and minerals not present on the UK label. The only meaningful difference appears to be using strawberry-flavored apple chunks. Does it make a difference? Probably none. - The doritos in the UK list an ingredient that's just "Cool Original Flavour" lmao that FB somehow decides not to highlight. The US requires a breakdown of the components of said "flavor." And the use of annatto vs FD&C dyes which there's really very little conclusive evidence one way or the other. But fine, I guess we can stop using Azo dyes. The real question is: does swapping Azo dyes for anatto make Doritos measurably healthier or is the problem that you are eating Doritos.