5 ms·

key findings: they discovered the brain's waste removal during NREM sleep (the glymphatic system) is driven by rhythmic norepinephrine pulses controlling coord

key findings: they discovered the brain's waste removal during NREM sleep (the glymphatic system) is driven by rhythmic norepinephrine pulses controlling coordinated blood vessel movements. *Zolpidem (Ambien) suppresses this cleaning process by interfering with norepinephrine pulses* This has implications for Alzheimer's and dementia.

echelon 2y ago
Went to look up Ambien's company's stock. Google Gemini is hallucinating like crazy: > Cosette Pharmaceuticals is permanently closed, so there is no stock for the company. > Cosette Pharmaceuticals was a pharmaceutical company that manufactured topical creams, ointments, oral liquids, and suppositories. They had facilities in New Jersey and North Carolina. No, Google. They're just a private company. Thanks, Google. Beyond this, I can't imagine this drug will be something people will want to continue taking. It was already posited to not be good for Alzheimer's, and now they have a smoking gun for a plausible mechanism.
- Aurornis 2y ago
  > Went to look up Ambien's company's stock. Ambien has been generic for a very long time. It's not an expensive drug. It's also not even indicated for long-term nightly use. You can find stories online of people who get continuous prescriptions from their doctor, but doing so is a rare practice. Most doctors are nervous to prescribe any drug of this class right now. When they do, it's only for short-term or occasional use. I don't think this is really a pitchforks-out moment against drug companies.
- habitue 2y ago
  It's one study, on mice. This is the beginning of a long chain where more studies are done -> a consensus is formed -> doctors start to hear about the consensus and take it into account prescribing it It could plausibly be 20 years before that plays out
- AbstractH24 2y ago
  The other day, I asked Gemini for suggestions on "sunny places in Latin America to visit in January," it recommended Miami. I'm done with it for another 6 months again.
grahamj 2y ago
musk takes Ambien; explains a few things
- boringg 2y ago
  hey, not everything has to do with musk - he's already enough places without your post.
  - MrMcCall 2y ago
    He's already got enough sycophants, too.
    - smnplk 2y ago
      He is one of the best Diablo players in the world. You gotta respect that /s
boringg 2y ago
Question -- will pharma companies try and slander downplay this article?
- ajmurmann 2y ago
  Seems like this is an issue for the company that makes Ambien but an opportunity for everyone else in that industry (and for patients)
- Jimmc414 2y ago
  (edit)
  - _Wintermute 2y ago
    It's mentioned in the abstract and 45 times in the article. Most scientists don't use the brand name of a drug.
    - deleted 2y ago
      [deleted]
    - deleted 2y ago
      [deleted]
- jayd16 2y ago
  Why do that when they can sell you even more drugs. Need the glymphowhatever to happily walk down a beach? Try Ambien-G.
  - AbstractH24 2y ago
    There really are no medications on the market indicated for long term use to help with sleep. Often doctors prescribe low dose Seroquel, but that has its own laundry lists of problems.
    - Gud 2y ago
TheRealPomax 2y ago
still needs a plain word version of what "norepinephrine pulses" are supposed to be.
- varunneal 2y ago
  norepinephrine = primary neurotransmitter for the sympathetic nervous system (fight or flight). Mostly produced in brain stem/adrenal glands.
- vaylian 2y ago
  Norepinephrine is a hormone which triggers motions of the blood vessels to support the transport of cellular waste products out of the brain.
pjerem 2y ago
> Zolpidem (Ambien) suppresses this cleaning process by interfering with norepinephrine pulses Forever or only when taken ? (I can only read the abstract)
Aurornis 2y ago
> This has implications for Alzheimer's and dementia. Long term use of drugs that interact with the GABA-A receptor have been known to be associated with dementia risk for a very long time. Zolpidem (Ambien) isn't indicated for long-term use, but there are some doctors who ignore this and prescribe long-term. It's rare, though. I think some people are drawing narrow conclusions from the use of Zolpidem in this study. They're not saying Zolpidem uniquely causes this problem, they're just showing that Zolpidem was one way to trigger this. It's like a property of many sedative hypnotics and quite possibly other types of sleep aids, too. Demonizing Zolpidem isn't the point of this study.
- jvanderbot 2y ago
  Including Alcohol?
seydor 2y ago
> implications for Alzheimer's every other neuroscience paper has that coda

echelon 2y ago

Went to look up Ambien's company's stock. Google Gemini is hallucinating like crazy: > Cosette Pharmaceuticals is permanently closed, so there is no stock for the company. > Cosette Pharmaceuticals was a pharmaceutical company that manufactured topical creams, ointments, oral liquids, and suppositories. They had facilities in New Jersey and North Carolina. No, Google. They're just a private company. Thanks, Google. Beyond this, I can't imagine this drug will be something people will want to continue taking. It was already posited to not be good for Alzheimer's, and now they have a smoking gun for a plausible mechanism.

Aurornis 2y ago
> Went to look up Ambien's company's stock. Ambien has been generic for a very long time. It's not an expensive drug. It's also not even indicated for long-term nightly use. You can find stories online of people who get continuous prescriptions from their doctor, but doing so is a rare practice. Most doctors are nervous to prescribe any drug of this class right now. When they do, it's only for short-term or occasional use. I don't think this is really a pitchforks-out moment against drug companies.
habitue 2y ago
It's one study, on mice. This is the beginning of a long chain where more studies are done -> a consensus is formed -> doctors start to hear about the consensus and take it into account prescribing it It could plausibly be 20 years before that plays out
AbstractH24 2y ago
The other day, I asked Gemini for suggestions on "sunny places in Latin America to visit in January," it recommended Miami. I'm done with it for another 6 months again.

grahamj 2y ago

musk takes Ambien; explains a few things

boringg 2y ago
hey, not everything has to do with musk - he's already enough places without your post.
- MrMcCall 2y ago
  He's already got enough sycophants, too.
  - smnplk 2y ago
    He is one of the best Diablo players in the world. You gotta respect that /s

boringg 2y ago

Question -- will pharma companies try and slander downplay this article?

ajmurmann 2y ago
Seems like this is an issue for the company that makes Ambien but an opportunity for everyone else in that industry (and for patients)
Jimmc414 2y ago
(edit)
- _Wintermute 2y ago
  It's mentioned in the abstract and 45 times in the article. Most scientists don't use the brand name of a drug.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
jayd16 2y ago
Why do that when they can sell you even more drugs. Need the glymphowhatever to happily walk down a beach? Try Ambien-G.
- AbstractH24 2y ago
  There really are no medications on the market indicated for long term use to help with sleep. Often doctors prescribe low dose Seroquel, but that has its own laundry lists of problems.
  - Gud 2y ago

TheRealPomax 2y ago

still needs a plain word version of what "norepinephrine pulses" are supposed to be.

varunneal 2y ago
norepinephrine = primary neurotransmitter for the sympathetic nervous system (fight or flight). Mostly produced in brain stem/adrenal glands.
vaylian 2y ago
Norepinephrine is a hormone which triggers motions of the blood vessels to support the transport of cellular waste products out of the brain.

pjerem 2y ago

> Zolpidem (Ambien) suppresses this cleaning process by interfering with norepinephrine pulses Forever or only when taken ? (I can only read the abstract)

Aurornis 2y ago

> This has implications for Alzheimer's and dementia. Long term use of drugs that interact with the GABA-A receptor have been known to be associated with dementia risk for a very long time. Zolpidem (Ambien) isn't indicated for long-term use, but there are some doctors who ignore this and prescribe long-term. It's rare, though. I think some people are drawing narrow conclusions from the use of Zolpidem in this study. They're not saying Zolpidem uniquely causes this problem, they're just showing that Zolpidem was one way to trigger this. It's like a property of many sedative hypnotics and quite possibly other types of sleep aids, too. Demonizing Zolpidem isn't the point of this study.

jvanderbot 2y ago
Including Alcohol?

seydor 2y ago

> implications for Alzheimer's every other neuroscience paper has that coda