4 ms·

I found the movie interesting in that they managed to make the Confederates the good guys by simply never showing a Black person on screen or mentioning slavery

by mkl 2y ago

I found the movie interesting in that they managed to make the Confederates the good guys by simply never showing a Black person on screen or mentioning slavery. There were a few good stunts and it was worth watching as a historical curiosity, but I didn't think it was all that good as a movie. I'm not American, so may have missed some things that would have let me follow the story better.

db48x 2y ago
It’s a comedy; the sides don’t matter. It’s a hilarious movie, in fact.
hilbert42 2y ago
I'm not an American either so I've not a patriotic fervor over the outcome of the Civil War to the extent as that most Americans have. That the movie showed the Confederates in better light than the Yankees wasn't appreciated much when it was released. Back then, there were Civil War veterans who were still alive who criticized the film which contributed to its poor ratings. Also, keep in mind the film was based on the story The Great Locomotive Chase, changing it to having the Yankees as the main subject just wouldn't have been feasible. Nevertheless, the film's stature has grown over the years and has developed a bit of a cult status: https://www.oregonencyclopedia.org/articles/the_general_film/ https://www.oregonencyclopedia.org/articles/the_general_film... https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_General_(1926_film) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_General_(1926_film) (read 'Legacy') Oh, and I just noticed on the Wiki page there's even an image of Keaton riding the cowcatcher. I'm not a film buff so I'll let those comments/reviews stand on their own merits.
- saalweachter 2y ago
  Some context for non-Americans: the 1920s (when the film was released) was the hey-day of Civil War revisionism; that was when most of the statues of Confederate generals were erected and the narrative of the noble Confederates was written. "1920s film made Confederates the good guys" is one of the least surprising things ever.
  - hilbert42 2y ago
    Thanks for that, that's a perspective of which I was unaware but I've long been aware there was a reasonable level of criticism when the film was released. It's notable from this outsider's perspective that there's still levels of animosity over the War and that statues of Lee get desecrated and or damaged from time to time.
    - saalweachter 2y ago
      Well, it wasn't just putting up statues and making movies where the Confederates were the good guys -- the 1920s was also the peak of organized white supremacy like the Ku Klux Klan, when lynching and other mob violence was common. The Tulsa massacre, which involved burning one of the wealthiest black neighborhoods in the United States, was only 5 years before this film came out. You can kind of think of this era as a sort of "anti-Civil Rights movement", and it was the same group of people burning houses and lynching and putting up statues and working politically to keep black Americans disenfranchised. And it's still a salient issue today -- disenfranchisement of minorities (closing polls in minority neighborhoods to create multi-hour waits to vote; gerrymandering to concentrate minorities in a small number of Congressional districts; disproportional felony convictions and the accompanying loss of franchise) is an issue in every election. Hell, one of the initial backlashes against public health measures early on in the COVID pandemic was that the early waves primarily affected large cities and the initial mortality rates were higher for blacks than whites, so it was viewed as a problem more for blacks than whites, and therefore, not a problem. The white-washing of Lee and the other Confederate traitors is still part of modern American politics -- it reframes the Civil War from a bunch of rich slave-owners rebelling against the United States to maintain their power and privilege, and getting hundreds of thousands of other people killed for it, to cast these men as victims of a rapacious Federal government meddling where it didn't belong. This narrative that was (and is still, eg, Shelby County v Holder) used to claim the Federal government had no right to improve the lives of minorities over the wishes of the States, is now used to claim the Federal government has no right to mandate minimum wages, or environmental regulations, or educational standards, or a thousand other things, over the wishes of the individual States. So it's still modern politics to cast down Lee and declare that he was not a noble martyr fighting for States Rights against an oppressive Federal government, just a traitor to his oaths who was personally and politically reprehensible. And to point out that States Rights have always just been a political shell game -- Slave States were happy to use the power of the Federal government to override the will of Free States, and force them to extradite escaped slaves back to the Slave States, just like issues like abortion are "sent back to the States" until a Federal ban can be passed, at which point it will miraculously no longer be an issue for the States to resolve. It's the old quote -- "The past is never dead. It's not even past."
- nejsjsjsbsb 2y ago
  The entire film is embedded on the wiki page. Public domain is cool!
  - hilbert42 2y ago
    If you can, buy a DVD copy from Kino, it's a much higher quality copy than any of the public domain copies available. In fact, the quantity is quite excellent. The reason the DVD copy is in copyright is because it has a new musical soundtrack. That said, the soundtrack is excellent and the music (which includes Civil War tunes) is both appropriate and is well integrated into the visual material.
throw4847285 2y ago
I recommend listening to the episode of the Blank Check podcast about The General (and Battling Butler), if you can sanction some buffoonery. It's a mix of a comedy podcast and deep movie analysis, which is not for everybody. For that episode they brought in writer Jamelle Bouie who is both a huge movie buff and a student of American history who brings in some great perspective on the Lost Cause. https://podcasts.apple.com/ca/podcast/battling-butler-the-general-with-jamelle-bouie/id981330533?i=1000614733661 https://podcasts.apple.com/ca/podcast/battling-butler-the-ge...
- hilbert42 2y ago
  Have started listening to it, thanks.

by mkl 2y ago

db48x 2y ago

It’s a comedy; the sides don’t matter. It’s a hilarious movie, in fact.

hilbert42 2y ago

I'm not an American either so I've not a patriotic fervor over the outcome of the Civil War to the extent as that most Americans have. That the movie showed the Confederates in better light than the Yankees wasn't appreciated much when it was released. Back then, there were Civil War veterans who were still alive who criticized the film which contributed to its poor ratings. Also, keep in mind the film was based on the story The Great Locomotive Chase, changing it to having the Yankees as the main subject just wouldn't have been feasible. Nevertheless, the film's stature has grown over the years and has developed a bit of a cult status: https://www.oregonencyclopedia.org/articles/the_general_film/ https://www.oregonencyclopedia.org/articles/the_general_film... https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_General_(1926_film) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_General_(1926_film) (read 'Legacy') Oh, and I just noticed on the Wiki page there's even an image of Keaton riding the cowcatcher. I'm not a film buff so I'll let those comments/reviews stand on their own merits.

saalweachter 2y ago
Some context for non-Americans: the 1920s (when the film was released) was the hey-day of Civil War revisionism; that was when most of the statues of Confederate generals were erected and the narrative of the noble Confederates was written. "1920s film made Confederates the good guys" is one of the least surprising things ever.
- hilbert42 2y ago
  Thanks for that, that's a perspective of which I was unaware but I've long been aware there was a reasonable level of criticism when the film was released. It's notable from this outsider's perspective that there's still levels of animosity over the War and that statues of Lee get desecrated and or damaged from time to time.
  - saalweachter 2y ago
    Well, it wasn't just putting up statues and making movies where the Confederates were the good guys -- the 1920s was also the peak of organized white supremacy like the Ku Klux Klan, when lynching and other mob violence was common. The Tulsa massacre, which involved burning one of the wealthiest black neighborhoods in the United States, was only 5 years before this film came out. You can kind of think of this era as a sort of "anti-Civil Rights movement", and it was the same group of people burning houses and lynching and putting up statues and working politically to keep black Americans disenfranchised. And it's still a salient issue today -- disenfranchisement of minorities (closing polls in minority neighborhoods to create multi-hour waits to vote; gerrymandering to concentrate minorities in a small number of Congressional districts; disproportional felony convictions and the accompanying loss of franchise) is an issue in every election. Hell, one of the initial backlashes against public health measures early on in the COVID pandemic was that the early waves primarily affected large cities and the initial mortality rates were higher for blacks than whites, so it was viewed as a problem more for blacks than whites, and therefore, not a problem. The white-washing of Lee and the other Confederate traitors is still part of modern American politics -- it reframes the Civil War from a bunch of rich slave-owners rebelling against the United States to maintain their power and privilege, and getting hundreds of thousands of other people killed for it, to cast these men as victims of a rapacious Federal government meddling where it didn't belong. This narrative that was (and is still, eg, Shelby County v Holder) used to claim the Federal government had no right to improve the lives of minorities over the wishes of the States, is now used to claim the Federal government has no right to mandate minimum wages, or environmental regulations, or educational standards, or a thousand other things, over the wishes of the individual States. So it's still modern politics to cast down Lee and declare that he was not a noble martyr fighting for States Rights against an oppressive Federal government, just a traitor to his oaths who was personally and politically reprehensible. And to point out that States Rights have always just been a political shell game -- Slave States were happy to use the power of the Federal government to override the will of Free States, and force them to extradite escaped slaves back to the Slave States, just like issues like abortion are "sent back to the States" until a Federal ban can be passed, at which point it will miraculously no longer be an issue for the States to resolve. It's the old quote -- "The past is never dead. It's not even past."
nejsjsjsbsb 2y ago
The entire film is embedded on the wiki page. Public domain is cool!
- hilbert42 2y ago
  If you can, buy a DVD copy from Kino, it's a much higher quality copy than any of the public domain copies available. In fact, the quantity is quite excellent. The reason the DVD copy is in copyright is because it has a new musical soundtrack. That said, the soundtrack is excellent and the music (which includes Civil War tunes) is both appropriate and is well integrated into the visual material.

throw4847285 2y ago

I recommend listening to the episode of the Blank Check podcast about The General (and Battling Butler), if you can sanction some buffoonery. It's a mix of a comedy podcast and deep movie analysis, which is not for everybody. For that episode they brought in writer Jamelle Bouie who is both a huge movie buff and a student of American history who brings in some great perspective on the Lost Cause. https://podcasts.apple.com/ca/podcast/battling-butler-the-general-with-jamelle-bouie/id981330533?i=1000614733661 https://podcasts.apple.com/ca/podcast/battling-butler-the-ge...

hilbert42 2y ago
Have started listening to it, thanks.