3 ms·
I am a Qubes user for a couple years now, and I wish I'd switched to it years earlier. Basically every criticism you hear is about correct-- principally worse
by nullc 2y ago
I am a Qubes user for a couple years now, and I wish I'd switched to it years earlier.
Basically every criticism you hear is about correct-- principally worse graphics performance and battery life. But the performance issues for me were less bad than I expected, and the seamlessness of its usability was much much higher than I expected.
Like copy and paste, moving files between VMs, plugging usb devices into VMs, networking, etc. all pretty much just work. It's pretty impressive if you have any idea of the machinery under the hood needed to make that work.
And now I don't feel anywhere near as nervous that whatever vendor program I need to use to configure a device or browser zero day is going to compromise my system. I can read documents from adverse threat actor sources in a netless VM and feel reasonably confident that it can't phone home or steal my data, etc.
Obviously it doesn't replace real air gap security, but it's the closest thing you can get to a network of airgapped or firewalled per-application computers which you can fit into a laptop bag.
I also like that I can use software that really only works right on fedora/redhat along side software that really only works right on debian. (Or windows, for that matter, but it's not as seamless). I like that I can substantially upgrade my operating system while running--- like I went from fedora40 to 41 just by installing the template, and switching over appvms one at a time. If anything goes wrong it's trivial to roll back, and I can have some app vms that work fine on the new stuff while others are held back if there is a compatibility issue. I like that applications that go nuts and try to use all my memory only screw up the VM that they're in instead of my whole system.
It's so nice that when I want to get something working I can spin up a vm and scribble all over it until I get it working. Binary patch my libc, whatever. Then once I've solved it, I can apply the final clean solution to a persistent template. Any random experimentation just goes away when I close the appvm. Need some program just for a single thing? install it in the appvm rather than the template and it naturally is gone later. I can be intentional about changes being either ephemeral or persistent, and never have to worry that the removal of something temporary was incomplete.
Of course YMMV, -- if you're someone who is mostly doing text and low performance graphics and can run it on a fast computer then its costs will be small. If you'd find a ten year old computer perfectly usable chances are that qubes on a modern computer won't seem slow or poor battery lifed to you. Particularly if you have other computers for games, 3d gfx, full screen video, etc. If you are someone who has been subjected to targeted hacking attempts the increased peace of mind will be substantial.
- fsflover 2y ago> Obviously it doesn't replace real air gap security Depending on your use case, Qubes can be even more secure:: https://www.qubes-os.org/faq/#how-does-qubes-os-compare-to-using-a-separate-physical-machine https://www.qubes-os.org/faq/#how-does-qubes-os-compare-to-u...
- rkagerer 2y ago- There’s generally no secure way to transfer data between physically separate computers running conventional OSes. - Malware which can bridge air gaps has existed for several years now and is becoming increasingly common. Floppy disks Hard disks used like floppies (especially plugged into a RAID controller with "auto run"-like features disabled) Audio modem Manual transcription via keyboard
- nullc 2y agoI would personally have chalked that up as usability-- because there are facilities for secure file transfer between computers, but I get the argument. Particularly since the common tools like SCP give way too much access unless you go through special effort. > Floppy disks, Hard disks As you note there are 'auto run' like issues, also file systems are not historically very robust against against malicious data. Hard disks themselves have host flash-able firmware and microcontrollers and get either DMA access (e.g. over SATA) to the system or get USB connected and the ability to pretend to be arbitrary usb devices like HID or exploit vulnerable usb drivers. So at least in theory a compromised system can turn your drive malicious such that it compromises other systems. Though an attacker that sophisticated probably also has hypervisor escapes. > Audio modem, Manual transcription Personally I'm fond of just RS232 serial.
- rkagerer 2y agoWas there ever a case in the wild of malware being installed into a host by inserting a floppy disk, without entailing the user boot off it, run a program from it, open a datafile crafted to exploit existing software, etc? I always thought if you insert a floppy (with any OS autorun crap turned off of course), open a textfile to read, then take it out, you'd be pretty safe. (It's unfortunate the same can't be said of a USB drive). Thanks, I missed RS-232.