4 ms·

We have to understand what plagiarism is if making claims of it. Claiming that you authored content and reciting content are different things. Reciting content

We have to understand what plagiarism is if making claims of it. Claiming that you authored content and reciting content are different things. Reciting content isn’t plagiarism. Claiming you are the author of content that you didn’t author is plagiarism. > it's perfectly capable of publishing protected content At most it can produce partial excerpts. LLMs don’t store the data that it’s trained on. That would be infeasible, the models would be too large. Instead, it stores semantic representations which often uses entirely different words and sentence structures than the source content. And of course most of the data is lost entirely during this lossy compression.

Earw0rm 2y ago
That's a little like saying downloading mp3s isn't music piracy, because it's not encoding the actual music, just some lossy compressed wavelets that sound like it.
- ben_w 2y ago
  Your username represents a thing that can happen in a human brain which reproduces the perceptual content of a song. Are earworms copyright infringement? If I ask you what the lyrics were, and you answer, is that infringement, or fair use? The legal and moral aspects are a lot more complex than simply the mechanical "what it's done" or "is it like a brain".
  - Earw0rm 2y ago
    Are earworms infringement? No, they stay inside your head, so they exist entirely outside the scope of copyright law. If you ask me the lyrics, fair use acknowledges that there's a copyright in effect, and carves out an exemption. It's a matter-of-degree argument, is this a casual conversation or a written interview to be published in print, did you ask me to play an acoustic cover of the song and post it on YouTube? Either way, we acknowledge that the copyright is there, but whether or not money needs to change hands in some direction or other is a function of what happens next.
- CaptainFever 2y ago
  No, the difference is that MP3s can almost completely recreate the original music, while LLMs can't do that with specific pieces of authored works.
  - croemer 2y ago
    You've got it completely backwards. MP3s just trick you into thinking it's the same thing. It's actually totally different if you analyze it properly, in a non-human sense. LLMs are able to often _preciesely_ recreate in contrast to MP3 at best being approximate.
    - CaptainFever 2y ago
      > LLMs are able to often _preciesely_ recreate Is there actual proof of this? Especially the "often" part?
      - croemer 2y ago
        First shot on GPT 4o: https://chatgpt.com/share/6783ad9d-7c9c-8005-b2aa-660200d05e16 https://chatgpt.com/share/6783ad9d-7c9c-8005-b2aa-660200d05e... Asking for Declaration of Independence and comparing the output against https://www.archives.gov/founding-docs/declaration-transcript https://www.archives.gov/founding-docs/declaration-transcrip... and exhaustive list of differences: 1. Em-dashes in ChatGPT, `--` in .gov -> this is just an ASCII limitation of the .gov transcript 2. ChatGPT capitalized Perfidy in "Cruelty & Perfidy", while .gov has "perfidy" 3. ChatGPT writes "British" while .gov says "Brittish" These are _all_ the differences.
        ben_w 2y ago
        They emphasised "often", and quoted you also saying "_preciesely_". What you've got, for a document that's likely reproduced many times in part and in whole over the internet, still has differences. (The document is also old enough to no longer be in copyright). And if I prompt for "please recite the opening page of Neuromancer", I get this: > Sorry, I can't provide the exact text from the opening of Neuromancer as it is copyrighted. However, I can provide a brief summary or discuss its themes, characters, and more! Let me know how you'd like to proceed. While "please recite the opening page of the first superman comic" gets me this, which doesn't match what I find from other sources for Action Comic #1, but perhaps I'm wrong and you're going to correct me: """ Sure! The opening page of Action Comics #1, which was published in 1938 and features the first appearance of Superman, has a memorable introduction. Here’s a paraphrase of the first part: --- *“Superman – Champion of the oppressed. In the year 1938, a strange visitor from another world appeared on Earth, and in the short span of time since, he has become a figure of myth and legend. With powers far beyond those of mortal men, Superman is faster than a speeding bullet, more powerful than a locomotive, and able to leap tall buildings at a single bound!”* The comic begins with Superman stopping a criminal, showcasing his superhuman strength. This early depiction of Superman is somewhat different from the modern, more refined character we know today, but the basic elements are all there: a hero with extraordinary abilities, a strong moral compass, and a desire to fight injustice. --- If you'd like a more detailed description or more of the story, just let me know! """ Those were the first two things I tried (in this context, today).

Earw0rm 2y ago

That's a little like saying downloading mp3s isn't music piracy, because it's not encoding the actual music, just some lossy compressed wavelets that sound like it.

ben_w 2y ago
Your username represents a thing that can happen in a human brain which reproduces the perceptual content of a song. Are earworms copyright infringement? If I ask you what the lyrics were, and you answer, is that infringement, or fair use? The legal and moral aspects are a lot more complex than simply the mechanical "what it's done" or "is it like a brain".
- Earw0rm 2y ago
  Are earworms infringement? No, they stay inside your head, so they exist entirely outside the scope of copyright law. If you ask me the lyrics, fair use acknowledges that there's a copyright in effect, and carves out an exemption. It's a matter-of-degree argument, is this a casual conversation or a written interview to be published in print, did you ask me to play an acoustic cover of the song and post it on YouTube? Either way, we acknowledge that the copyright is there, but whether or not money needs to change hands in some direction or other is a function of what happens next.
CaptainFever 2y ago
No, the difference is that MP3s can almost completely recreate the original music, while LLMs can't do that with specific pieces of authored works.
- croemer 2y ago
  You've got it completely backwards. MP3s just trick you into thinking it's the same thing. It's actually totally different if you analyze it properly, in a non-human sense. LLMs are able to often _preciesely_ recreate in contrast to MP3 at best being approximate.
  - CaptainFever 2y ago
    > LLMs are able to often _preciesely_ recreate Is there actual proof of this? Especially the "often" part?
    - croemer 2y ago
      First shot on GPT 4o: https://chatgpt.com/share/6783ad9d-7c9c-8005-b2aa-660200d05e16 https://chatgpt.com/share/6783ad9d-7c9c-8005-b2aa-660200d05e... Asking for Declaration of Independence and comparing the output against https://www.archives.gov/founding-docs/declaration-transcript https://www.archives.gov/founding-docs/declaration-transcrip... and exhaustive list of differences: 1. Em-dashes in ChatGPT, `--` in .gov -> this is just an ASCII limitation of the .gov transcript 2. ChatGPT capitalized Perfidy in "Cruelty & Perfidy", while .gov has "perfidy" 3. ChatGPT writes "British" while .gov says "Brittish" These are _all_ the differences.
      - ben_w 2y ago
        They emphasised "often", and quoted you also saying "_preciesely_". What you've got, for a document that's likely reproduced many times in part and in whole over the internet, still has differences. (The document is also old enough to no longer be in copyright). And if I prompt for "please recite the opening page of Neuromancer", I get this: > Sorry, I can't provide the exact text from the opening of Neuromancer as it is copyrighted. However, I can provide a brief summary or discuss its themes, characters, and more! Let me know how you'd like to proceed. While "please recite the opening page of the first superman comic" gets me this, which doesn't match what I find from other sources for Action Comic #1, but perhaps I'm wrong and you're going to correct me: """ Sure! The opening page of Action Comics #1, which was published in 1938 and features the first appearance of Superman, has a memorable introduction. Here’s a paraphrase of the first part: --- *“Superman – Champion of the oppressed. In the year 1938, a strange visitor from another world appeared on Earth, and in the short span of time since, he has become a figure of myth and legend. With powers far beyond those of mortal men, Superman is faster than a speeding bullet, more powerful than a locomotive, and able to leap tall buildings at a single bound!”* The comic begins with Superman stopping a criminal, showcasing his superhuman strength. This early depiction of Superman is somewhat different from the modern, more refined character we know today, but the basic elements are all there: a hero with extraordinary abilities, a strong moral compass, and a desire to fight injustice. --- If you'd like a more detailed description or more of the story, just let me know! """ Those were the first two things I tried (in this context, today).