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I think you are missing something. Clubs have always been the „mothers“ of raves. This has been the case since the only days of chicago warehouse parties up unt
by HellDunkel 2y ago
I think you are missing something. Clubs have always been the „mothers“ of raves. This has been the case since the only days of chicago warehouse parties up until what is now the case in berlin. Once the clubs go away, the off location parties will disappear next.
- ashoeafoot 2y agoall it takes is a quarry and a sound system .
- coldtea 2y ago>I think you are missing something. Clubs have always been the „mothers“ of raves This is rewriting history. Raves was a british thing, and it was in the open, not in clubs. Chicago warehouse parties preceded raves and are important for electronic dance music history, but are not raves.
- geden 2y agoI went to my first rave in 1991 in Sheffield City Ballroom. There was plenty of raving indoors and in clubs in Sheffield and Leeds in the early 90s.
- coldtea 2y agoThey existed, but where they "raves" or just clubs and venues playing rave music? Proper raves where the DIY open or underground fare, secretly organized, communicated with flyers or whisper-net, etc. And when the 1994 act banned them there was a lot of (justified) anger from the rave "community"! In any case, still a British thing.
- thom 2y agoStill going strong. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-south-yorkshire-64776907 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-south-yorkshire-647769...
- geden 2y agoI disagree with your definition of a “proper” rave. Not inclusive enough. There was loud rave music & ravers having a great time, ie it was a rave. Raves happened in secret and in the open. I went to both kinds. Pros and cons to both.
- wizardforhire 2y agoActually to be pedantic raves go way further back. The first mention of rave in modern writing goes back to 60s counter culture, think oil projections and proto-pysch rock… it self a continuation of the happenings from the beat era. The term was repurposed in the mid eigties when dance music got pushed underground after disco demolition night. Disco never died in the uk or europe even though the roots arguably of modern dance music starts there with the breakout kraut rock scene centered around Düsseldorf… and of course a lot of cross pollination. But to be even more pedantic the concept goes further than that as in the late 30s and forties there would be dance contests to see who could last the longest… To go even further than that jazz, before that polka… it being a folk version of the waltzes of the time. Newspapers of time read like madlibs only replace leather jackets and mohawks with polka dots. Quite a trip. Going back further pre industrialization its said you couldn't hear the orchestra over the sounds of fucking in the box seats on the balcony… the idea of stuffy classical concerts only emerging when the concert halls were opened to the burgeoning middle class and said class would dress up to rub shoulders with the aristocracy. But in antiquity the mystery religions of Dionysus would arguably be the first true raves in spirit. But every culture has its all night dances, from pow wows of the plains to suffi’s in the muslim world. Music is largely universal and a uniquely human endeavor, the oldest flutes found are made by Neanderthal. But techno?… thats all Detroit.
- coldtea 2y ago>But techno?… thats all Detroit. We're not talking about Techno per se though, but the so-called "rave parties" of the late 80s/early 90s associated with the namesake culture. A lot more than techno was involved, including acid house and later UK developments like jungle. (And to be pedantic in the same way, we can find it way before Detroit, e.g. in Dusseldorf and Moroder's Italy and NYC)
- antihero 2y agoWell raves were free parties, and could be outside or in like an abandoned warehouse etc.
- resource_waste 2y agoAmateur philosopher here: What is the debate going on here? Is it epistemology? Or linguistics? I imagine its some subset, if anyone can point me in the right direction, I'm interested.
- coldtea 2y agoNeither. It's definitional and/or historical.
- antihero 2y agoIt's trying to maintain definitions of things we love that are resistant to being lumped in with commercial parties, and hold the things we love about them as an important distinction. When I think "rave" I don't think about paying stupid money for drinks, being groped by security, mainstream artists and EDM ("musical gentrification") in general, curfews, expensive tickets, arbitrary rules, profiteering, or drugs/sexual expression being frowned on or barred. Raves should be counter-culture, anti-authoritarian, DIY, and anarchic. Bona-fide liberated situations that aren't behest of the rules and requirements of commercial events. This is a definition that shouldn't be diluted nor conflated.
- anakaine 2y agoI always wondered how they got enough power into abandoned places.
- randomfounder 2y agothey bring generators! There’s a surprising amount of planning and logistics involved, even for sketchy seeming events
- HellDunkel 2y agoThe brits have a tendency to claim a lot of things in regard to electronic music but they own „raves“ just as much as they own „acid house“.
- randomfounder 2y agoIn California at least, I think ravers hate clubs more than anyone. They’re expensive, inconvenient, and the impression is that they’re for superficial people with more money than sense. Raves are much cheaper ($100 to a see drunk rapper show up 45 min late, or $20 for 6 hours of techno on a better soundsytem), more convenient (more parking, reentry, no lines, chill security), and egalitarian (no VIPs, and acting like one is frowned upon). The crowd that goes to clubs, well at least mainstream clubs you’d find on Google Maps, seems to have almost no overlap with the crowd that goes to raves. It’s common to try clubbing for a bit in college to see what the hype’s about, then “graduate” to raves.