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And Apple just dreamed up the idea of a smartphone out of thin air? What about the touch screen? Multi-touch? Gridded icons? Rectangles? Apple is an imitat

And Apple just dreamed up the idea of a smartphone out of thin air? What about the touch screen? Multi-touch? Gridded icons? Rectangles? Apple is an imitator, a marketer, and a polisher of other people's ideas. Little more. Your blind worship is shamefully ignorant. Exhibit a) http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/bc/LG_KE850_Prada_Hauptmen%C3%BC.jpg/200px-LG_KE850_Prada_Hauptmen%C3%BC.jpg http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/bc/LG_... This preceded the first iPhone.

Steko 14y ago
See here's the fundamental difference: Apple clearly differentiates their products. Samsung intentionally copies closely. No one serious would argue either of those points. That is why Samsung is the defendant in all these design cases and Apple has never had this problem no matter how many times Engadget ditto heads want to bring up Steve Jobs "great artists steal" quote. When the judge holds up an LG Prada and an iPhone, Apple's lawyers wouldn't have trouble saying which phone is made by their company.
- tysonjennings 14y ago
  Bald assertions do not a non "Engadget dittohead" argument make. Apple has never produced a new product category. They take the innovations that came before and throw money and Steve Jobs/Jonny Ives taste at it. You are blind if you think that what Apple does is real innovation in the sense of what the actual producers of the cellphone did. Or the tablet for that matter. They haven't had a fresh idea since Woz built the Apple I out of a block of wood and a circuit board 40 years ago.
  - Steko 14y ago
    "Apple has never produced a new product category." "You are blind if you think that what Apple does is real innovation in the sense of what the actual producers of the cellphone did. " Please cite where I claimed they did? Straw man much? I'm just pointing out the difference between Samsung and Apple to you. They aren't the same. Apple clearly differentiates their products. Samsung aims for as little differentiation from the market leading designs as possible. It's true with refrigerators, washers, tablets, phones, etc. That's why the comment you were originally responding to disparaged Samsung. You drew a false equivalence between completely copying a product and making a smartphone that's very different from other smartphones but apparently is just as bad because it wasn't the very first smartphone Moses brought back down the mountain. Laughable.
    - tysonjennings 14y ago
      So your argument is that Samsung is imitating an imitator. Excuse me while I don't care.
      - Steko 14y ago
        Just put whatever words in my mouth that make you feel comfortable.
  - pndmnm 14y ago
    > Apple has never produced a new product category. They take the innovations that came before and throw money and Steve Jobs/Jonny Ives taste at it. Right -- or like we always say here on HN, it's not ideas that count, it's execution.
    - tysonjennings 14y ago
      I never said they didn't execute. Nice strawman though.
  - vacri 14y ago
    The fullscreen smartphone was a new category of theirs, wasn't it? The cynic in me would also say that mp3 players that don't have a radio were probably also pioneered by them :)
    - hahainternet 14y ago
      Not really. I still have one of these lying around somewhere: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HTC_TyTN http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HTC_TyTN There were many other options, and as usual Apple simplified and minimised.
      - jasomill 14y ago
        As importantly, they retargeted the marketing. The iPhone was introduced as an entertainment and Web device. Prior to this, all the major players (Microsoft, BlackBerry, and Palm, as well as carriers) pretty much worked under the assumption that "consumers" weren't willing to pay for "premium" phones, so smartphones before the iPhone were designed for and marketed to "mobile professionals" with features like personal organizers and push email. At the same time, "premium" $250+ iPods were flying off the shelves. But competing music players at similar price points were not, so I'd still tend to give more credit to Apple's execution than its "vision".
vvhn 14y ago
iPhone - Announced, demoed on stage on January 9, 2007. Went on sale June 2007. From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LG_Prada http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LG_Prada " It was first announced on December 12, 2006 .[2] Images of the device appeared on websites such as Engadget Mobile on December 15, 2006.[3] An official press release showing an image of the device appeared on January 18, 2007.[1] " I wouldn't claim it "preceded"
- ricardobeat 14y ago
  Right, because the iPhone was invented and built from the ground up between january and june 2007.

Steko 14y ago

See here's the fundamental difference: Apple clearly differentiates their products. Samsung intentionally copies closely. No one serious would argue either of those points. That is why Samsung is the defendant in all these design cases and Apple has never had this problem no matter how many times Engadget ditto heads want to bring up Steve Jobs "great artists steal" quote. When the judge holds up an LG Prada and an iPhone, Apple's lawyers wouldn't have trouble saying which phone is made by their company.

tysonjennings 14y ago
Bald assertions do not a non "Engadget dittohead" argument make. Apple has never produced a new product category. They take the innovations that came before and throw money and Steve Jobs/Jonny Ives taste at it. You are blind if you think that what Apple does is real innovation in the sense of what the actual producers of the cellphone did. Or the tablet for that matter. They haven't had a fresh idea since Woz built the Apple I out of a block of wood and a circuit board 40 years ago.
- Steko 14y ago
  "Apple has never produced a new product category." "You are blind if you think that what Apple does is real innovation in the sense of what the actual producers of the cellphone did. " Please cite where I claimed they did? Straw man much? I'm just pointing out the difference between Samsung and Apple to you. They aren't the same. Apple clearly differentiates their products. Samsung aims for as little differentiation from the market leading designs as possible. It's true with refrigerators, washers, tablets, phones, etc. That's why the comment you were originally responding to disparaged Samsung. You drew a false equivalence between completely copying a product and making a smartphone that's very different from other smartphones but apparently is just as bad because it wasn't the very first smartphone Moses brought back down the mountain. Laughable.
  - tysonjennings 14y ago
    So your argument is that Samsung is imitating an imitator. Excuse me while I don't care.
    - Steko 14y ago
      Just put whatever words in my mouth that make you feel comfortable.
- pndmnm 14y ago
  > Apple has never produced a new product category. They take the innovations that came before and throw money and Steve Jobs/Jonny Ives taste at it. Right -- or like we always say here on HN, it's not ideas that count, it's execution.
  - tysonjennings 14y ago
    I never said they didn't execute. Nice strawman though.
- vacri 14y ago
  The fullscreen smartphone was a new category of theirs, wasn't it? The cynic in me would also say that mp3 players that don't have a radio were probably also pioneered by them :)
  - hahainternet 14y ago
    Not really. I still have one of these lying around somewhere: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HTC_TyTN http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HTC_TyTN There were many other options, and as usual Apple simplified and minimised.
    - jasomill 14y ago
      As importantly, they retargeted the marketing. The iPhone was introduced as an entertainment and Web device. Prior to this, all the major players (Microsoft, BlackBerry, and Palm, as well as carriers) pretty much worked under the assumption that "consumers" weren't willing to pay for "premium" phones, so smartphones before the iPhone were designed for and marketed to "mobile professionals" with features like personal organizers and push email. At the same time, "premium" $250+ iPods were flying off the shelves. But competing music players at similar price points were not, so I'd still tend to give more credit to Apple's execution than its "vision".

vvhn 14y ago

iPhone - Announced, demoed on stage on January 9, 2007. Went on sale June 2007. From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LG_Prada http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LG_Prada " It was first announced on December 12, 2006 .[2] Images of the device appeared on websites such as Engadget Mobile on December 15, 2006.[3] An official press release showing an image of the device appeared on January 18, 2007.[1] " I wouldn't claim it "preceded"

ricardobeat 14y ago
Right, because the iPhone was invented and built from the ground up between january and june 2007.