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That is not because of him. They ran into patents problems and lost a lawsuit about this. They did contribute a couple of industry standards, including zerocon

That is not because of him. They ran into patents problems and lost a lawsuit about this. They did contribute a couple of industry standards, including zeroconf/bonjour and OpenCL. I haven’t seen anything or anybody saying that the FaceTime thing was a deception.

9rx 2y ago
Supposedly he announced it off the cuff, without consulting anyone else as to the viability, not even notifying the FaceTime team beforehand. You can get into a semantic argument with yourself about whether that is actually a lie, but no matter what you conclude, that seems to be the same kind of "lie" that Musk makes.
- me-vs-cat 2y ago
  > [an off the cuff promise] seems to be the same kind of "lie" [as charging $7,500 for future self-driving] No, it doesn't, and I cannot understand how they could seem so similar to you.
  - 9rx 2y ago
    I assume the intent here is for it to be a question with a forgotten question mark? Otherwise, the comment devolves into ad hominem without any technical exploration, and there is no conceivable expiation for that. Unfortunately, I am not entirely sure how to grok the question. What I am able to gather is that Musk sold a unrealized future promise on the basis of hopeful optimism as its own line item for $7,500, while Jobs sold an unrealized future promise on the basis of hopeful optimism as part of a bundle in the ballpark around $1,000, with some variation depending on the specific bundle purchased. Is the contention around the price magnitude? Would Musk be less of a "liar" if it sold for $100 instead of $7,500? Is it being sold independently instead of as part of a bundle what is in dispute? Would Musk be less of a "liar" if that $7,500 included other features available at the time of sale? Perhaps you can elaborate?
    - me-vs-cat 2y ago
      I would ask why you believe $1,000 was charged in exchange for a promise to turn FaceTime into an open industry standard -- which would be usable by all, by definition, regardless of whether they were even customers -- but you appear more interested in put-downs. "There is no conceivable expiation for that," so I'm done; good luck!

9rx 2y ago

Supposedly he announced it off the cuff, without consulting anyone else as to the viability, not even notifying the FaceTime team beforehand. You can get into a semantic argument with yourself about whether that is actually a lie, but no matter what you conclude, that seems to be the same kind of "lie" that Musk makes.

me-vs-cat 2y ago
> [an off the cuff promise] seems to be the same kind of "lie" [as charging $7,500 for future self-driving] No, it doesn't, and I cannot understand how they could seem so similar to you.
- 9rx 2y ago
  I assume the intent here is for it to be a question with a forgotten question mark? Otherwise, the comment devolves into ad hominem without any technical exploration, and there is no conceivable expiation for that. Unfortunately, I am not entirely sure how to grok the question. What I am able to gather is that Musk sold a unrealized future promise on the basis of hopeful optimism as its own line item for $7,500, while Jobs sold an unrealized future promise on the basis of hopeful optimism as part of a bundle in the ballpark around $1,000, with some variation depending on the specific bundle purchased. Is the contention around the price magnitude? Would Musk be less of a "liar" if it sold for $100 instead of $7,500? Is it being sold independently instead of as part of a bundle what is in dispute? Would Musk be less of a "liar" if that $7,500 included other features available at the time of sale? Perhaps you can elaborate?
  - me-vs-cat 2y ago
    I would ask why you believe $1,000 was charged in exchange for a promise to turn FaceTime into an open industry standard -- which would be usable by all, by definition, regardless of whether they were even customers -- but you appear more interested in put-downs. "There is no conceivable expiation for that," so I'm done; good luck!