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Almost every voter puts pocketbook issues near the top of their list, but not so far up that they’re willing to be civically active about it unless it’s a crisi
by CamperBob2 2y ago
Almost every voter puts pocketbook issues near the top of their list, but not so far up that they’re willing to be civically active about it unless it’s a crisis.
We're not in a crisis now, but people voted in the last national election as if we were, because Fox News told them that we were.
- JumpCrisscross 2y ago> because Fox News told them that we were This is my problem with the “elites in control” hypothesis. It seems to rely on voters’ power existing, but being circumvented because said voters are too stupid to handle it.
- CamperBob2 2y agoWell, that's pretty much the size of it, isn't it?
- ImPostingOnHN 2y ago> This is my problem with the “elites in control” hypothesis. It seems to rely on voters’ power existing, but being circumvented because said voters are too stupid to handle it. You are correct (except that it need only be a subset of voters). Now that you've done a good job of elaborating on the hypothesis, what exactly is your problem with it?
- JumpCrisscross 2y ago> what exactly is your problem with it? It doesn't work. Its testable predictions preclude a good amount of extant politics, including practically all populism. Elites the world over are losing in democracies because they presupposed, from afar, that they knew what their constituents wanted. Voters' interests are complex, and they can't be so easily bought.
- llamaimperative 2y agoThat is a huuugely presumptive interpretation. Here’s another possible interpretation: our information environment makes people extremely vulnerable to actual bullshit in massive volume.
- JumpCrisscross 2y ago> Here’s another possible interpretation: our information environment makes people extremely vulnerable to actual bullshit in massive volume That is also true. People get angry and then misdirect it. But the anger is real, and it filters up through the political system when the valves aren't clogged. They aren't, not anywhere in the West. Voters across the West have essentially begun a wholesale replacement of their stable of elites. That is not what happens in an oligarchic system.
- llamaimperative 2y agoThat is absolutely how oligarchic systems supplant democracies. Hitler was elected, Orban was elected, Bukele was elected.
- JumpCrisscross 2y ago> Hitler was elected, Orban was elected, Bukele was elected None of them emerged from oligarchic political systems.
- llamaimperative 2y agoIf your argument is "the US was not a pure oligarchy 4, 8, or 12 years ago", sure. I don't think that's what people are pointing out.
- immibis 2y agoAnd Putin and the first supreme leader of North Korea. Democracies can turn into dictatorships quickly. But don't worry - it can't happen here.