4 ms·

> I really appreciate when brands just name things like they are. Sure, but I find this branding even more confusing. "Dude, you're getting a Dell!" "Oh, nea

by imiric 2y ago

> I really appreciate when brands just name things like they are. Sure, but I find this branding even more confusing. "Dude, you're getting a Dell!" "Oh, neat! Is it a PC or laptop?" "It's a Dell Pro... laptop." "..." At least with XPS, Latitude, etc., consumers were able to easily distinguish between models, after getting familiar with the product line. Naming all products "<company name> [Pro,Pro Max]" will always be clear as mud. Not to mention that "Pro Max Premium Plus Ultra" is dumb, in that Apple way. Apple is notorious for naming all their products the same, so consumers have to use launch years to distinguish them.

legitster 2y ago
If you find this branding more confusing, then you are probably not familiar with laptop shopping in this segment. Here are all of the 2024 models available: Latitude 9450, Latitude 7350, Latitude 7350 Ultralight, Latitude 7350 Detachable, Latitude 7455, Latitude 7450, Latitude 7450 Ultralight, Latitude 7650, Latitude 5550, Latitude 5455, Latitude 5450, Latitude 5350, Latitude 3450, Latitude 3550. You have to memorize what you are looking at - the first digit is the model line, the second digit is a reference to the screen size, and the last set of digits a reference to the model year. So "Dell Latitude 5450" conveys all the same information as "2024 Dell Pro 14" Plus". I'm not sure what's controversial about that change.
- imiric 2y ago
  I'm not a Dell customer, so I'm not familiar with their product lines, but from what you say "Dell Latitude 5450" is indeed clearer to me than "2024 Dell Pro 14" Plus". I can get familiar with the number scheme and infer that higher numbers indicate better performance, larger screen, etc. "Pro" and "Plus" will always be meaningless and arbitrary.
  - vel0city 2y ago
    > infer that higher numbers indicate better performance But bigger numbers don't always indicate better performance. A Dell Latitude 6420 (a Sandy Bridge) is much slower than a 5420. Same with a 7320 versus a 5440.
    - imiric 2y ago
      Then that's a confusion the manufacturer should address. Consistency and clarity is key. But it's not solved by scrapping all of it in favor of "Plus", "Pro" and "Max".
      - vel0city 2y ago
        Here's four potential model numbers/names. Latitude 6420 Latitude 5540 Inspiron 5555 2011 Dell Pro 14" 2024 Dell Pro 15" 2024 Dell Pro Max 15" Which ones are the recent bigger laptops? Which is the older smaller laptop? Which is better, Inspiron or Latitude? Which is better, the Dell Pro or the Dell Pro Max? Which naming scheme makes these things way more obvious?
        imiric 2y ago
        I personally don't care about the year of release. The display size is good to know, but it doesn't tell me whether it's an IPS or OLED, which I care more about. Besides, I'm much more interested about the CPU, RAM, disk size, etc. So should all of these be part of the product name as well, just to please me? Probably not. Yet if the manufacturer segmented their product by arbitrary brand names (which could also be "Base", "Pro", "Max", etc. mind you; I just think these are overloaded terms, and custom terms like XPS, Latitude, etc. would be clearer), and then subdivided these with sensible model names that encoded this information, this would make more sense. Given that I as a consumer get familiar with it, which one might want to do before deciding to spend thousands on a product. Again, I'm not saying that Dell has done a good job at this, but potentially it _can_ be done well. For example, I think MikroTik does a decent job at this[1]. It does lead to product names that are difficult to parse/pronounce like "CSS326-24G-2S+RM", but once you're familiar with the scheme, it's easy to know which product has which specs, and to compare them. Anyway, it's fine if we disagree. I think we both made our case. [1]: https://wiki.mikrotik.com/Manual:Product_Naming https://wiki.mikrotik.com/Manual:Product_Naming
        vel0city 2y ago
        I totally get the naming scheme of practically every technical feature being exposed in the model number, but outside of selling to techie people you'll quickly lose people in trying to remember what was recommended. I don't have a problem remembering what model Supermicro board is on my router build, but I totally understand someone not having a clue what an X11SBA-LN4F is or have any clue on how to begin to compare that to some other Supermicro board. When it comes to selling to the mass market for a single big consumer electronic good like a laptop or phone or game console or whatever, it seems to me to be way simpler to just have a few decent SKUs. Having someone try and remember "Bill said I should get the CSS326-24G-2S+RM, or was that the 3326, wait is this the one with +RM or not, hmm this is complicated I guess I'll just get something else" is a lot more challenging than having someone remember "Bill said I should get at least the Pro version; oh, that's the listing for the 2023 model I want the newer one, there we go." You'll really burn a customer when they get confused by the naming scheme and think they're getting one thing but then when they get it home it doesn't work like their friend's because their friend is rocking the 7730-G3-M-QQ-7i gizmowidget as opposed to the 7730-G3-N-QQ-7i gizmowidget.
- Ferret7446 2y ago
  I think those kinds of model numbers are fine, as long as it's prominently explained somewhere and I don't have to chase down some forum post from a few years ago because the company can't be bothered to explain its own products to its customers.
vel0city 2y ago
> consumers were able to easily distinguish between models I don't think I could ever remember which of the Inspiron or Latitude lines were supposed to be higher end without looking at the magazine and seeing the prices. I just kind of assumed "Precision" meant their high-end workstations. And I'm someone who fawned over computers and gadgets my whole life.
karmakaze 2y ago
Yeah you know it's bad when "Laptop" literally has to be in the proper name, e.g. "Microsoft Surface Laptop Go" because the "Microsoft Surface Go" is a tablet computer line before the successful branding got applied to regular laptops. The worst I saw was single-use coffee packets for the hotel room coffee machine that comes in regular and decaf (with brown or green color stripes to distinguish them)... except the green is regular and brown is decaf.

by imiric 2y ago

legitster 2y ago

If you find this branding more confusing, then you are probably not familiar with laptop shopping in this segment. Here are all of the 2024 models available: Latitude 9450, Latitude 7350, Latitude 7350 Ultralight, Latitude 7350 Detachable, Latitude 7455, Latitude 7450, Latitude 7450 Ultralight, Latitude 7650, Latitude 5550, Latitude 5455, Latitude 5450, Latitude 5350, Latitude 3450, Latitude 3550. You have to memorize what you are looking at - the first digit is the model line, the second digit is a reference to the screen size, and the last set of digits a reference to the model year. So "Dell Latitude 5450" conveys all the same information as "2024 Dell Pro 14" Plus". I'm not sure what's controversial about that change.

imiric 2y ago
I'm not a Dell customer, so I'm not familiar with their product lines, but from what you say "Dell Latitude 5450" is indeed clearer to me than "2024 Dell Pro 14" Plus". I can get familiar with the number scheme and infer that higher numbers indicate better performance, larger screen, etc. "Pro" and "Plus" will always be meaningless and arbitrary.
- vel0city 2y ago
  > infer that higher numbers indicate better performance But bigger numbers don't always indicate better performance. A Dell Latitude 6420 (a Sandy Bridge) is much slower than a 5420. Same with a 7320 versus a 5440.
  - imiric 2y ago
    Then that's a confusion the manufacturer should address. Consistency and clarity is key. But it's not solved by scrapping all of it in favor of "Plus", "Pro" and "Max".
    - vel0city 2y ago
      Here's four potential model numbers/names. Latitude 6420 Latitude 5540 Inspiron 5555 2011 Dell Pro 14" 2024 Dell Pro 15" 2024 Dell Pro Max 15" Which ones are the recent bigger laptops? Which is the older smaller laptop? Which is better, Inspiron or Latitude? Which is better, the Dell Pro or the Dell Pro Max? Which naming scheme makes these things way more obvious?
      - imiric 2y ago
        I personally don't care about the year of release. The display size is good to know, but it doesn't tell me whether it's an IPS or OLED, which I care more about. Besides, I'm much more interested about the CPU, RAM, disk size, etc. So should all of these be part of the product name as well, just to please me? Probably not. Yet if the manufacturer segmented their product by arbitrary brand names (which could also be "Base", "Pro", "Max", etc. mind you; I just think these are overloaded terms, and custom terms like XPS, Latitude, etc. would be clearer), and then subdivided these with sensible model names that encoded this information, this would make more sense. Given that I as a consumer get familiar with it, which one might want to do before deciding to spend thousands on a product. Again, I'm not saying that Dell has done a good job at this, but potentially it _can_ be done well. For example, I think MikroTik does a decent job at this[1]. It does lead to product names that are difficult to parse/pronounce like "CSS326-24G-2S+RM", but once you're familiar with the scheme, it's easy to know which product has which specs, and to compare them. Anyway, it's fine if we disagree. I think we both made our case. [1]: https://wiki.mikrotik.com/Manual:Product_Naming https://wiki.mikrotik.com/Manual:Product_Naming
        vel0city 2y ago
        I totally get the naming scheme of practically every technical feature being exposed in the model number, but outside of selling to techie people you'll quickly lose people in trying to remember what was recommended. I don't have a problem remembering what model Supermicro board is on my router build, but I totally understand someone not having a clue what an X11SBA-LN4F is or have any clue on how to begin to compare that to some other Supermicro board. When it comes to selling to the mass market for a single big consumer electronic good like a laptop or phone or game console or whatever, it seems to me to be way simpler to just have a few decent SKUs. Having someone try and remember "Bill said I should get the CSS326-24G-2S+RM, or was that the 3326, wait is this the one with +RM or not, hmm this is complicated I guess I'll just get something else" is a lot more challenging than having someone remember "Bill said I should get at least the Pro version; oh, that's the listing for the 2023 model I want the newer one, there we go." You'll really burn a customer when they get confused by the naming scheme and think they're getting one thing but then when they get it home it doesn't work like their friend's because their friend is rocking the 7730-G3-M-QQ-7i gizmowidget as opposed to the 7730-G3-N-QQ-7i gizmowidget.
Ferret7446 2y ago
I think those kinds of model numbers are fine, as long as it's prominently explained somewhere and I don't have to chase down some forum post from a few years ago because the company can't be bothered to explain its own products to its customers.

vel0city 2y ago

> consumers were able to easily distinguish between models I don't think I could ever remember which of the Inspiron or Latitude lines were supposed to be higher end without looking at the magazine and seeing the prices. I just kind of assumed "Precision" meant their high-end workstations. And I'm someone who fawned over computers and gadgets my whole life.

karmakaze 2y ago

Yeah you know it's bad when "Laptop" literally has to be in the proper name, e.g. "Microsoft Surface Laptop Go" because the "Microsoft Surface Go" is a tablet computer line before the successful branding got applied to regular laptops. The worst I saw was single-use coffee packets for the hotel room coffee machine that comes in regular and decaf (with brown or green color stripes to distinguish them)... except the green is regular and brown is decaf.