5 ms·

I really appreciate when brands just name things like they are. Nothing is less fun than cross-shopping products and there are a bunch of arbitrary brand diffe

I really appreciate when brands just name things like they are. Nothing is less fun than cross-shopping products and there are a bunch of arbitrary brand differences. "Precisions are their portable workstations. Latitudes are their ultrabooks. Duh! XPS is their premium consumer laptop!". Marketing departments tend to get addicted to the smell of their own farts. But I don't think consumers care about particular sub-brand names. We already saw this a decade ago in the automotive space where manufacturers ditched their unnecessary marquees (Pontiac, Mercury, Oldsmobile, Saturn). And I think we will see this trend continue into more industries (like hotel chains).

xnx 2y ago
Apple has its share of naming problems but not attempting to artificially split their laptop product line between consumer and "enterprise" is something they should get credit for.
- pc86 2y ago
  I mean they do have "Air" and "Pro" monikers for the laptops, as well as a page dedicated to helping you choose which one to get - https://www.apple.com/mac/best-mac/ https://www.apple.com/mac/best-mac/ - so they're not using "consumer" or "enterprise" but it's still there.
  - ghaff 2y ago
    Well, except it's thinnest and bigger (with probably more ports though probably still not enough).
  - chrislongss 2y ago
    With one caveat - Air is very popular in the enterprise world. It's just so much lighter! And powerful enough to handle the vast majority of non-eng tasks.
  - xnx 2y ago
    Right, but Apple's naming does seem to differentiate between real hardware differences vs. artificial software ones (e.g. how much crapware is preloaded).
- spogbiper 2y ago
  naming aside, Dell (and other PC manufacturers) split enterprise from consumer for a number of reasons that make sense to me. the two markets have different requirements. enterprise needs a different OS license for one. Buying a fleet of X hundred or thousand devices vs one PC introduces concerns and requirements that home users just don't have and shouldn't pay for imho.
- legitster 2y ago
  One half of their product line literally has "Professional" in the name.
  - lotsofpulp 2y ago
    But the quality of components in an Air versus a Pro is presumed to be the same, just the specs are different. So all you are doing is shopping for the screen size, screen type, storage size, RAM, weight, etc that you need/want. Whereas, with a Dell or HP, I would have to figure out which models are going to be built with cheaper materials that will wear out or have a higher chance of breaking.
lizknope 2y ago
Product names make no sense. Some web sites make a "product selection tool" where you answer a bunch of questions and it tries to direct you to models that will suit your needs. I was recently buying a Seasonic power supply. What is the difference between Prime, Vertex, Focus, or Core series? Then there is Prime TX, Prime PX, Prime GX. I have no idea what all this is. I ended up just picking something in the 800W range with the modular power outputs that I needed.
- kwanbix 2y ago
  I call it the Toothpaste Dilemma: When you go to buy toothpaste, like Colgate or most brands, you're bombarded with so many options. It gets worse when you read the labels—everything seems either identical or has massive overlaps. It's frustrating and unnecessarily complicated.
  - legitster 2y ago
    I legit use the term "Toothpaste Shopping" to describe any miserably complex shopping experience. (Although ironically, toothpaste shopping is quite easy once you know the correct answer is "the cheapest brand at the store that has fluoride in it")
    - extraduder_ire 2y ago
      Unless you're looking for some other feature. Once I learned what novamin was, I started getting a toothpaste with that in it. I think only two such brands exist.
  - rs999gti 2y ago
    > I call it the Toothpaste Dilemma It's called Tyranny of Choice - https://longevity.stanford.edu/the-tyranny-of-choice/ https://longevity.stanford.edu/the-tyranny-of-choice/ > Too many options can decrease the likelihood of making any decision at all
    - kwanbix 2y ago
imiric 2y ago
> I really appreciate when brands just name things like they are. Sure, but I find this branding even more confusing. "Dude, you're getting a Dell!" "Oh, neat! Is it a PC or laptop?" "It's a Dell Pro... laptop." "..." At least with XPS, Latitude, etc., consumers were able to easily distinguish between models, after getting familiar with the product line. Naming all products "<company name> [Pro,Pro Max]" will always be clear as mud. Not to mention that "Pro Max Premium Plus Ultra" is dumb, in that Apple way. Apple is notorious for naming all their products the same, so consumers have to use launch years to distinguish them.
- legitster 2y ago
  If you find this branding more confusing, then you are probably not familiar with laptop shopping in this segment. Here are all of the 2024 models available: Latitude 9450, Latitude 7350, Latitude 7350 Ultralight, Latitude 7350 Detachable, Latitude 7455, Latitude 7450, Latitude 7450 Ultralight, Latitude 7650, Latitude 5550, Latitude 5455, Latitude 5450, Latitude 5350, Latitude 3450, Latitude 3550. You have to memorize what you are looking at - the first digit is the model line, the second digit is a reference to the screen size, and the last set of digits a reference to the model year. So "Dell Latitude 5450" conveys all the same information as "2024 Dell Pro 14" Plus". I'm not sure what's controversial about that change.
  - imiric 2y ago
    I'm not a Dell customer, so I'm not familiar with their product lines, but from what you say "Dell Latitude 5450" is indeed clearer to me than "2024 Dell Pro 14" Plus". I can get familiar with the number scheme and infer that higher numbers indicate better performance, larger screen, etc. "Pro" and "Plus" will always be meaningless and arbitrary.
    - vel0city 2y ago
      > infer that higher numbers indicate better performance But bigger numbers don't always indicate better performance. A Dell Latitude 6420 (a Sandy Bridge) is much slower than a 5420. Same with a 7320 versus a 5440.
Lio 2y ago
I think problem is not so much having named product lines but having too many overlapping product lines. Having loads of random product numbers is really no better than named ranges. If you only have 3 product lines then people will learn the names and can understand the differences when shopping.
JohnBooty 2y ago
Marketing departments tend to get addicted to the smell of their own farts. That's not necessarily why they do it. Pontiac, Mercury, Oldsmobile, Saturn So part of the reason they do it is simply to flood the market. Imagine a world where GM has Saturn, Pontiac, Oldsmobile, Geo, Chevy, GMC, etc. And Ford just has... Ford. To a casual, who doesn't know or care that six of those brands are just GM nameplates, they just see seven options for a sedan. And if I'm GM, I certainly like the odds that they'll pick a GM even though I'm essentially just designing one or two sedans and then advertising them six different ways. A simpler example (that somebody else mentioned down below) is toothpaste. There are like, ten different varieties of Colgate on the shelf. The point isn't that they expect me the consumer to know or care about the differences, or that they are so "addicted to the smell of their own farts" that they think there's a meaningful difference between brands of Colgate. The point is that they want to consume shelf space, crowd other brands out, and send the message that they are the default, safe choice for toothpaste. We can say that's dumb, but I suspect the sales figures would tell us they're having some success with that.
tim333 2y ago
I kind of like the way Apple does it - when the M1 came out you could get the air or the pro and that was it. And the difference was simple - basically the pro was chunkier with a fan and a bit faster. With Dell I'd have no idea which one to get and what was good.

xnx 2y ago

Apple has its share of naming problems but not attempting to artificially split their laptop product line between consumer and "enterprise" is something they should get credit for.

pc86 2y ago
I mean they do have "Air" and "Pro" monikers for the laptops, as well as a page dedicated to helping you choose which one to get - https://www.apple.com/mac/best-mac/ https://www.apple.com/mac/best-mac/ - so they're not using "consumer" or "enterprise" but it's still there.
- ghaff 2y ago
  Well, except it's thinnest and bigger (with probably more ports though probably still not enough).
- chrislongss 2y ago
  With one caveat - Air is very popular in the enterprise world. It's just so much lighter! And powerful enough to handle the vast majority of non-eng tasks.
- xnx 2y ago
  Right, but Apple's naming does seem to differentiate between real hardware differences vs. artificial software ones (e.g. how much crapware is preloaded).
spogbiper 2y ago
naming aside, Dell (and other PC manufacturers) split enterprise from consumer for a number of reasons that make sense to me. the two markets have different requirements. enterprise needs a different OS license for one. Buying a fleet of X hundred or thousand devices vs one PC introduces concerns and requirements that home users just don't have and shouldn't pay for imho.
legitster 2y ago
One half of their product line literally has "Professional" in the name.
- lotsofpulp 2y ago
  But the quality of components in an Air versus a Pro is presumed to be the same, just the specs are different. So all you are doing is shopping for the screen size, screen type, storage size, RAM, weight, etc that you need/want. Whereas, with a Dell or HP, I would have to figure out which models are going to be built with cheaper materials that will wear out or have a higher chance of breaking.

lizknope 2y ago

Product names make no sense. Some web sites make a "product selection tool" where you answer a bunch of questions and it tries to direct you to models that will suit your needs. I was recently buying a Seasonic power supply. What is the difference between Prime, Vertex, Focus, or Core series? Then there is Prime TX, Prime PX, Prime GX. I have no idea what all this is. I ended up just picking something in the 800W range with the modular power outputs that I needed.

kwanbix 2y ago
I call it the Toothpaste Dilemma: When you go to buy toothpaste, like Colgate or most brands, you're bombarded with so many options. It gets worse when you read the labels—everything seems either identical or has massive overlaps. It's frustrating and unnecessarily complicated.
- legitster 2y ago
  I legit use the term "Toothpaste Shopping" to describe any miserably complex shopping experience. (Although ironically, toothpaste shopping is quite easy once you know the correct answer is "the cheapest brand at the store that has fluoride in it")
  - extraduder_ire 2y ago
    Unless you're looking for some other feature. Once I learned what novamin was, I started getting a toothpaste with that in it. I think only two such brands exist.
- rs999gti 2y ago
  > I call it the Toothpaste Dilemma It's called Tyranny of Choice - https://longevity.stanford.edu/the-tyranny-of-choice/ https://longevity.stanford.edu/the-tyranny-of-choice/ > Too many options can decrease the likelihood of making any decision at all
  - kwanbix 2y ago

imiric 2y ago

> I really appreciate when brands just name things like they are. Sure, but I find this branding even more confusing. "Dude, you're getting a Dell!" "Oh, neat! Is it a PC or laptop?" "It's a Dell Pro... laptop." "..." At least with XPS, Latitude, etc., consumers were able to easily distinguish between models, after getting familiar with the product line. Naming all products "<company name> [Pro,Pro Max]" will always be clear as mud. Not to mention that "Pro Max Premium Plus Ultra" is dumb, in that Apple way. Apple is notorious for naming all their products the same, so consumers have to use launch years to distinguish them.

legitster 2y ago
If you find this branding more confusing, then you are probably not familiar with laptop shopping in this segment. Here are all of the 2024 models available: Latitude 9450, Latitude 7350, Latitude 7350 Ultralight, Latitude 7350 Detachable, Latitude 7455, Latitude 7450, Latitude 7450 Ultralight, Latitude 7650, Latitude 5550, Latitude 5455, Latitude 5450, Latitude 5350, Latitude 3450, Latitude 3550. You have to memorize what you are looking at - the first digit is the model line, the second digit is a reference to the screen size, and the last set of digits a reference to the model year. So "Dell Latitude 5450" conveys all the same information as "2024 Dell Pro 14" Plus". I'm not sure what's controversial about that change.
- imiric 2y ago
  I'm not a Dell customer, so I'm not familiar with their product lines, but from what you say "Dell Latitude 5450" is indeed clearer to me than "2024 Dell Pro 14" Plus". I can get familiar with the number scheme and infer that higher numbers indicate better performance, larger screen, etc. "Pro" and "Plus" will always be meaningless and arbitrary.
  - vel0city 2y ago
    > infer that higher numbers indicate better performance But bigger numbers don't always indicate better performance. A Dell Latitude 6420 (a Sandy Bridge) is much slower than a 5420. Same with a 7320 versus a 5440.

Lio 2y ago

I think problem is not so much having named product lines but having too many overlapping product lines. Having loads of random product numbers is really no better than named ranges. If you only have 3 product lines then people will learn the names and can understand the differences when shopping.

JohnBooty 2y ago

Marketing departments tend to get addicted to the smell of their own farts. That's not necessarily why they do it. Pontiac, Mercury, Oldsmobile, Saturn So part of the reason they do it is simply to flood the market. Imagine a world where GM has Saturn, Pontiac, Oldsmobile, Geo, Chevy, GMC, etc. And Ford just has... Ford. To a casual, who doesn't know or care that six of those brands are just GM nameplates, they just see seven options for a sedan. And if I'm GM, I certainly like the odds that they'll pick a GM even though I'm essentially just designing one or two sedans and then advertising them six different ways. A simpler example (that somebody else mentioned down below) is toothpaste. There are like, ten different varieties of Colgate on the shelf. The point isn't that they expect me the consumer to know or care about the differences, or that they are so "addicted to the smell of their own farts" that they think there's a meaningful difference between brands of Colgate. The point is that they want to consume shelf space, crowd other brands out, and send the message that they are the default, safe choice for toothpaste. We can say that's dumb, but I suspect the sales figures would tell us they're having some success with that.

tim333 2y ago

I kind of like the way Apple does it - when the M1 came out you could get the air or the pro and that was it. And the difference was simple - basically the pro was chunkier with a fan and a bit faster. With Dell I'd have no idea which one to get and what was good.