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Do you not recall the general Democratic sentiment of a vaccine while Trump was in office and he was the one pushing for it? Many Democratic leaders were on the

Do you not recall the general Democratic sentiment of a vaccine while Trump was in office and he was the one pushing for it? Many Democratic leaders were on the record calling it Trump's vaccine and either implying or directly saying that they wouldn't trust it and that it couldn't be rushed through the process. If you're referring to RFK as the anti-vaxxer, unless I'm mistaken he has been pretty clear that he isn't opposed to vaccines in general. I don't know all of his arguments or views, but the limited stuff I've seen from or about him indicates that he was opposed to the Covid vaccine and the process it was rushed through with little to no scientific study. I haven't seen him argue against all vaccines, my guess is he is more in favor of the more standard approach of things like attenuated virus vaccines.

scarface_74 2y ago
RFK believes that vaccines cause autism https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c0mzk2y41zvo.amp https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c0mzk2y41zvo.amp
- _heimdall 2y ago
  Sure, he has said this but the few times I've heard him discuss it in any length he raises concerns over how little we know given how vaccine safety studies are done. He also raises examples of individuals he has met with stories that, in his opinion, are concerning enough to raise questions for him whether there is a link between certain vaccines and autism rates. > Vaccination has probably saved more lives and is better researched than most, if not all, aspects of healthcare. It's worth noting that the fact checking article you linked to doesn't really include much in the way of fact checking. They don't include and then discredit specific studies or data points that RFK uses. They do include a few quotes from credentialed individuals like the one above, though it ultimately says nothing and includes fluffy words like "probably saved..." With that said, I have no idea how much of a smoking gun there might be linking vaccines to autism. My point here isn't that RFK is right, but it is important to at least represent his arguments accurately and to discredit with proper data to show that his view isn't backed by the data.
  - scarface_74 2y ago
    > Sure, he has said this but the few times I've heard him discuss it in any length he raises concerns over how little we know given how vaccine safety studies are done. He also raises examples of individuals he has met with stories that, in his opinion, are concerning enough to raise questions for him whether there is a link between certain vaccines and autism rates His “concerns” about autism has been debunked repeatedly and not taken seriously by anyone in the scientific community. He was claiming a link between autism and vaccines for vaccines that did go through the standard approval process and have been around for years. There is no “data” about vaccines link to autism.
    - _heimdall 2y ago
      > There is no “data” about vaccines link to autism. Vaccine use and autism rates are pretty well correlated. In no way does that imply causation and I agree that RFK leans too heavily into thinking that link exists, but it is also the case that we don't have much good scientific data there either way. Studies for vaccine safety generally don't follow a timeline necessary to pick up links to autism or similar conditions that either take years to develop, or show up one generation down. That isn't unreasonable, the number of confounding factors there would be next to impossible to isolate over such a long time. That still leaves us with little more than modelling and epidemiology to either prove or disprove the link though, at least as I read that the argument couldn't be settled either way.

scarface_74 2y ago

RFK believes that vaccines cause autism https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c0mzk2y41zvo.amp https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c0mzk2y41zvo.amp

_heimdall 2y ago
Sure, he has said this but the few times I've heard him discuss it in any length he raises concerns over how little we know given how vaccine safety studies are done. He also raises examples of individuals he has met with stories that, in his opinion, are concerning enough to raise questions for him whether there is a link between certain vaccines and autism rates. > Vaccination has probably saved more lives and is better researched than most, if not all, aspects of healthcare. It's worth noting that the fact checking article you linked to doesn't really include much in the way of fact checking. They don't include and then discredit specific studies or data points that RFK uses. They do include a few quotes from credentialed individuals like the one above, though it ultimately says nothing and includes fluffy words like "probably saved..." With that said, I have no idea how much of a smoking gun there might be linking vaccines to autism. My point here isn't that RFK is right, but it is important to at least represent his arguments accurately and to discredit with proper data to show that his view isn't backed by the data.
- scarface_74 2y ago
  > Sure, he has said this but the few times I've heard him discuss it in any length he raises concerns over how little we know given how vaccine safety studies are done. He also raises examples of individuals he has met with stories that, in his opinion, are concerning enough to raise questions for him whether there is a link between certain vaccines and autism rates His “concerns” about autism has been debunked repeatedly and not taken seriously by anyone in the scientific community. He was claiming a link between autism and vaccines for vaccines that did go through the standard approval process and have been around for years. There is no “data” about vaccines link to autism.
  - _heimdall 2y ago
    > There is no “data” about vaccines link to autism. Vaccine use and autism rates are pretty well correlated. In no way does that imply causation and I agree that RFK leans too heavily into thinking that link exists, but it is also the case that we don't have much good scientific data there either way. Studies for vaccine safety generally don't follow a timeline necessary to pick up links to autism or similar conditions that either take years to develop, or show up one generation down. That isn't unreasonable, the number of confounding factors there would be next to impossible to isolate over such a long time. That still leaves us with little more than modelling and epidemiology to either prove or disprove the link though, at least as I read that the argument couldn't be settled either way.