4 ms·

Even though saying "small nitpick" is redundant in terms of its literal meaning (denotation), communication is about more than simple denotation. It's also abou

Even though saying "small nitpick" is redundant in terms of its literal meaning (denotation), communication is about more than simple denotation. It's also about emphasis, tone, and emotions, and saying "small nitpick" can be a good way to soften criticism and add a little humility and politeness.

wrboyce 2y ago
This particular linguistic construct is called a pleonasm! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pleonasm https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pleonasm
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- Stratoscope 2y ago
  One example the article notes is tuna fish. When I was a kid, tuna and tuna fish were two different things. Tuna was tuna straight out of the can, with nothing added. After all, the can says tuna right on it. Tuna fish was tuna mixed with mayonnaise and crunchy things like pickles and celery. It was what today would be called tuna salad. So if mom asked, "would you like a tuna sandwich for lunch?" we would reply "can we please have a tuna fish sandwich instead?" Because who wants plain tuna in a sandwich? If she asked if we wanted a tuna salad sandwich, we would be completely confused. Is it a salad or is it a sandwich?
  - phist_mcgee 2y ago
    Never heard of tuna fish as a phrase, do you say salmon fish and anchovy fish? Genuine question.
    - wrboyce 2y ago
      This is almost certainly an American thing, we just don’t have “tuna fish” in British parlance. A “tuna sandwich” would be understood to be a tuna mayonnaise sandwich, sometimes with surprise crunchy bits and sometimes without. You do occasionally see “tuna crunch” used to explicitly denote the addition of, most commonly, red onion and bell peppers.
    - Stratoscope 2y ago
      I think the distinction between "tuna" and "tuna fish" (tuna salad) was likely just something we made up in our own family. Maybe even just a way for us kids to prank our mom, or vice versa. "Do you want tuna, or tuna fish?" OTOH, "tuna fish" was indeed a common phrase back in those days (mid 20th century) as a synonym for canned tuna. It appeared on tuna can labels and advertisements. Here are some examples: https://www.google.com/imgres?q=%22tuna%20fish%22%20advertisement&imgurl=https%3A%2F%2Fimages.squarespace-cdn.com%2Fcontent%2Fv1%2F5b64c5548f5130fa86e2fb2e%2F1624657029972-N61VN46TJE13PZOO88M9%2Fpuzzle.jpg&imgrefurl=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.palosverdespulse.com%2Fblog%2F2021%2F6%2F25%2Fit-tastes-like-chicken-how-local-canneries-marketed-fish-in-a-can-by-marifrances-trivelli-director-los-angeles-maritime-museum&docid=6VNNKLXDSBlYoM&tbnid=Wj1soSO3nYeJrM&vet=12ahUKEwjp6KeM4dyKAxWHOTQIHXRWI5kQM3oECD0QAA..i&w=1650&h=1275&hcb=2&ved=2ahUKEwjp6KeM4dyKAxWHOTQIHXRWI5kQM3oECD0QAA https://www.google.com/imgres?q=%22tuna%20fish%22%20advertis... https://www.palosverdespulse.com/blog/2021/6/25/it-tastes-like-chicken-how-local-canneries-marketed-fish-in-a-can-by-marifrances-trivelli-director-los-angeles-maritime-museum https://www.palosverdespulse.com/blog/2021/6/25/it-tastes-li... Over the years, "tuna fish" fell out of common use, which may explain why you haven't heard of it. Here is a conversation I had with ChatGPT 4o about this: https://chatgpt.com/share/677988fd-28b0-8012-af63-5bd59985a2f4 https://chatgpt.com/share/677988fd-28b0-8012-af63-5bd59985a2... To answer your question, no, we never said salmon fish or anchovy fish. Just tuna fish. Language and its evolution is an interesting thing!
      - imiric 2y ago
        This thread reads like AIs talking to each other. Bizarre.
        Stratoscope 2y ago
        Really? I can assure you that everything I said was my own writing. I did use Miss Chatty (ChatGPT 4o) as a research assistant, and cited my discussion with her in my comment. If you don't mind, I am curious to learn what signals in my comments led you to think that I am an AI. :-) Maybe there is something you know about me that I don't know!
- cloverich 2y ago
  I've always wondered what the name for this was! When I was younger I noticed a common one in some of my social groups, "small little"; I'd always wondered whether it was a cultural phenomena (someone said it, then it kept spreading) or a more natural diminutive (like I think "small nitpick" is).

wrboyce 2y ago

This particular linguistic construct is called a pleonasm! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pleonasm https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pleonasm

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
Stratoscope 2y ago
One example the article notes is tuna fish. When I was a kid, tuna and tuna fish were two different things. Tuna was tuna straight out of the can, with nothing added. After all, the can says tuna right on it. Tuna fish was tuna mixed with mayonnaise and crunchy things like pickles and celery. It was what today would be called tuna salad. So if mom asked, "would you like a tuna sandwich for lunch?" we would reply "can we please have a tuna fish sandwich instead?" Because who wants plain tuna in a sandwich? If she asked if we wanted a tuna salad sandwich, we would be completely confused. Is it a salad or is it a sandwich?
- phist_mcgee 2y ago
  Never heard of tuna fish as a phrase, do you say salmon fish and anchovy fish? Genuine question.
  - wrboyce 2y ago
    This is almost certainly an American thing, we just don’t have “tuna fish” in British parlance. A “tuna sandwich” would be understood to be a tuna mayonnaise sandwich, sometimes with surprise crunchy bits and sometimes without. You do occasionally see “tuna crunch” used to explicitly denote the addition of, most commonly, red onion and bell peppers.
  - Stratoscope 2y ago
    I think the distinction between "tuna" and "tuna fish" (tuna salad) was likely just something we made up in our own family. Maybe even just a way for us kids to prank our mom, or vice versa. "Do you want tuna, or tuna fish?" OTOH, "tuna fish" was indeed a common phrase back in those days (mid 20th century) as a synonym for canned tuna. It appeared on tuna can labels and advertisements. Here are some examples: https://www.google.com/imgres?q=%22tuna%20fish%22%20advertisement&imgurl=https%3A%2F%2Fimages.squarespace-cdn.com%2Fcontent%2Fv1%2F5b64c5548f5130fa86e2fb2e%2F1624657029972-N61VN46TJE13PZOO88M9%2Fpuzzle.jpg&imgrefurl=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.palosverdespulse.com%2Fblog%2F2021%2F6%2F25%2Fit-tastes-like-chicken-how-local-canneries-marketed-fish-in-a-can-by-marifrances-trivelli-director-los-angeles-maritime-museum&docid=6VNNKLXDSBlYoM&tbnid=Wj1soSO3nYeJrM&vet=12ahUKEwjp6KeM4dyKAxWHOTQIHXRWI5kQM3oECD0QAA..i&w=1650&h=1275&hcb=2&ved=2ahUKEwjp6KeM4dyKAxWHOTQIHXRWI5kQM3oECD0QAA https://www.google.com/imgres?q=%22tuna%20fish%22%20advertis... https://www.palosverdespulse.com/blog/2021/6/25/it-tastes-like-chicken-how-local-canneries-marketed-fish-in-a-can-by-marifrances-trivelli-director-los-angeles-maritime-museum https://www.palosverdespulse.com/blog/2021/6/25/it-tastes-li... Over the years, "tuna fish" fell out of common use, which may explain why you haven't heard of it. Here is a conversation I had with ChatGPT 4o about this: https://chatgpt.com/share/677988fd-28b0-8012-af63-5bd59985a2f4 https://chatgpt.com/share/677988fd-28b0-8012-af63-5bd59985a2... To answer your question, no, we never said salmon fish or anchovy fish. Just tuna fish. Language and its evolution is an interesting thing!
    - imiric 2y ago
      This thread reads like AIs talking to each other. Bizarre.
      - Stratoscope 2y ago
        Really? I can assure you that everything I said was my own writing. I did use Miss Chatty (ChatGPT 4o) as a research assistant, and cited my discussion with her in my comment. If you don't mind, I am curious to learn what signals in my comments led you to think that I am an AI. :-) Maybe there is something you know about me that I don't know!
cloverich 2y ago
I've always wondered what the name for this was! When I was younger I noticed a common one in some of my social groups, "small little"; I'd always wondered whether it was a cultural phenomena (someone said it, then it kept spreading) or a more natural diminutive (like I think "small nitpick" is).