5 ms·

This is really a puff piece - for instance, Nokia had a 1 billion pixels per second processing pipeline on their 808 PureView phone. In 2012.

dylan604 2y ago
what on cnet is not a puff piece?
CharlesW 2y ago
Even so, the "camera first" Nokia 808 PureView took notably worse photos (DxOMark Mobile Photo score: 60) than the iPhone 7 (score: 86) and other flagship phones (Samsung Galaxy S6 Edge score: 86) of that time.
- gregoriol 2y ago
  Size is not the only metric that matters
- n144q 2y ago
  iPhone 7 was released in 2016, 4 years after 808 was released. Can't see what your point is.
rob_c 2y ago
Unless apple invented it, no they didn't and you're wrong... The cult of apple kinda says everything wrong about the valley to me. This isn't magicians at work with secret spells, this is just cutting edge tech that is at the point of being commodity. Making something appealing to idiots has drawbacks, less repairability, less durability etc and now even apple is slowly reverting even this under govt changes...
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- scarface_74 2y ago
  If iOS has a majority market share in the US, wouldn’t anyone who is not using an iPhone be part of the “cult”? And I bet if I drop my phone, it would be a lot easier to drive to one of the five Apple Stores in the metro area to get it repaired than it would be for you to get your camera repaired. That’s not even considering the fact that it could service a drop better than your camera and is water resistant
  - n144q 2y ago
    > That’s not even considering the fact that it could service a drop better than your camera and is water resistant Definitely need citations for this.
    - scarface_74 2y ago
      https://kenrockwell.com/nikon/18200/18200-drop-test.htm https://kenrockwell.com/nikon/18200/18200-drop-test.htm https://www.imaging-resource.com/news/2013/05/23/camera-meet-concrete-will-canon-or-nikon-triumph-in-the-DSLR-drop-test https://www.imaging-resource.com/news/2013/05/23/camera-meet... Can you imagine any modern phone not surviving a 3 foot drop?
ilrwbwrkhv 2y ago
Yes, it definitely is. Once you notice the signs of PR, you can see this was being written because Apple's privacy story fell apart. This is really about hiding their entire SIRI recording your conversations without your permission.
londons_explore 2y ago
Indeed - it can mean simply a 1GHz data bus thats 32 bits wide. Pipeline all your image processing so it's 1 cycle per pixel and you're done.
dagmx 2y ago
Your comment is somewhat misleading. The 808, while a great high resolution sensor, processed stills at 5MP after pixel binning, compared to the 48/24/12MP of the iPhones. It did have a non-binned mode but again for stills. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nokia_808_PureView https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nokia_808_PureView The majority of the post is actually about video and the comparison is a lot more dramatic there. A 4k frame from a modern phone ,like the iPhone 16 pro, is ~8MP. The 808 could “only” do 1080p at 30fps (62M pixels a second). Compare that to 4k at 120fps (995M pixels a second). That’s a far cry from 1Bn per second that you’re claiming. Impressive for the time though. There’s a significant difference here. The sensor on the 808 was amazing. The real meat of the tech here is the image processing pipeline that can process everything off the sensor for further processing.
- shrubble 2y ago
  The issue is not what Nokia did with it, but the presence of the functionality. The binning and other features were enabled (poorly or not isn’t part of the discussion) by a chip that could do about 1 billion pixels per second; that’s the issue; Apple doing it 12 years later and hyping it is what I was commenting on.
  - dagmx 2y ago
    No, the issue is that you’re misrepresenting the facts of the device. The processing you’re talking about could not handle 1Bn pixels a second except for maybe the very frontend of the pipeline. It could not handle it beyond that, which is where the meat of any ISP is. It’s easy to dismiss the technology if you allow yourself to dismiss the majority of what needs to be done past the sensor read out.
    - shrubble 2y ago
      It's the Broadcom BCM2763, also known as the VideoCore IV. The datasheet is still available. This is happening well beyond the sensor read-out and the fact you are mentioning that, tells me you don't actually understand the architecture at the necessary level. Sorry.

dylan604 2y ago

what on cnet is not a puff piece?

CharlesW 2y ago

Even so, the "camera first" Nokia 808 PureView took notably worse photos (DxOMark Mobile Photo score: 60) than the iPhone 7 (score: 86) and other flagship phones (Samsung Galaxy S6 Edge score: 86) of that time.

gregoriol 2y ago
Size is not the only metric that matters
n144q 2y ago
iPhone 7 was released in 2016, 4 years after 808 was released. Can't see what your point is.

rob_c 2y ago

Unless apple invented it, no they didn't and you're wrong... The cult of apple kinda says everything wrong about the valley to me. This isn't magicians at work with secret spells, this is just cutting edge tech that is at the point of being commodity. Making something appealing to idiots has drawbacks, less repairability, less durability etc and now even apple is slowly reverting even this under govt changes...

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]
scarface_74 2y ago
If iOS has a majority market share in the US, wouldn’t anyone who is not using an iPhone be part of the “cult”? And I bet if I drop my phone, it would be a lot easier to drive to one of the five Apple Stores in the metro area to get it repaired than it would be for you to get your camera repaired. That’s not even considering the fact that it could service a drop better than your camera and is water resistant
- n144q 2y ago
  > That’s not even considering the fact that it could service a drop better than your camera and is water resistant Definitely need citations for this.
  - scarface_74 2y ago
    https://kenrockwell.com/nikon/18200/18200-drop-test.htm https://kenrockwell.com/nikon/18200/18200-drop-test.htm https://www.imaging-resource.com/news/2013/05/23/camera-meet-concrete-will-canon-or-nikon-triumph-in-the-DSLR-drop-test https://www.imaging-resource.com/news/2013/05/23/camera-meet... Can you imagine any modern phone not surviving a 3 foot drop?

ilrwbwrkhv 2y ago

Yes, it definitely is. Once you notice the signs of PR, you can see this was being written because Apple's privacy story fell apart. This is really about hiding their entire SIRI recording your conversations without your permission.

londons_explore 2y ago

Indeed - it can mean simply a 1GHz data bus thats 32 bits wide. Pipeline all your image processing so it's 1 cycle per pixel and you're done.

dagmx 2y ago

Your comment is somewhat misleading. The 808, while a great high resolution sensor, processed stills at 5MP after pixel binning, compared to the 48/24/12MP of the iPhones. It did have a non-binned mode but again for stills. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nokia_808_PureView https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nokia_808_PureView The majority of the post is actually about video and the comparison is a lot more dramatic there. A 4k frame from a modern phone ,like the iPhone 16 pro, is ~8MP. The 808 could “only” do 1080p at 30fps (62M pixels a second). Compare that to 4k at 120fps (995M pixels a second). That’s a far cry from 1Bn per second that you’re claiming. Impressive for the time though. There’s a significant difference here. The sensor on the 808 was amazing. The real meat of the tech here is the image processing pipeline that can process everything off the sensor for further processing.

shrubble 2y ago
The issue is not what Nokia did with it, but the presence of the functionality. The binning and other features were enabled (poorly or not isn’t part of the discussion) by a chip that could do about 1 billion pixels per second; that’s the issue; Apple doing it 12 years later and hyping it is what I was commenting on.
- dagmx 2y ago
  No, the issue is that you’re misrepresenting the facts of the device. The processing you’re talking about could not handle 1Bn pixels a second except for maybe the very frontend of the pipeline. It could not handle it beyond that, which is where the meat of any ISP is. It’s easy to dismiss the technology if you allow yourself to dismiss the majority of what needs to be done past the sensor read out.
  - shrubble 2y ago
    It's the Broadcom BCM2763, also known as the VideoCore IV. The datasheet is still available. This is happening well beyond the sensor read-out and the fact you are mentioning that, tells me you don't actually understand the architecture at the necessary level. Sorry.