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- "The vast majority of applications exist only for Windows, and speaking of games, Linux hasn't seen any AAA titles for many years now," The vast majority of
by perihelions 2y ago
- "The vast majority of applications exist only for Windows, and speaking of games, Linux hasn't seen any AAA titles for many years now,"
The vast majority of AAA titles run seamlessly on Linux. Per protondb[0], ≥80% of the top 10, top 100, and top 1000 are rated "platinum" or "gold" for Linux functioning (by users).
[0] https://www.protondb.com/ https://www.protondb.com/
- musicale 2y agoSteam Deck wouldn't be a thing if Steam/Windows games didn't run well on Proton/Linux.
- atoav 2y agoJust played Red Dead Redemtion 2 on Kubuntu 24. Doesn't get any more AAA than that.
- talldayo 2y ago> Also, despite millions of players, it's hard to call CS2 an AAA title because it's based on Direct3D 11 (which is now more than a decade old) and lacks modern lighting techniques like ray tracing. Some of the quotes from the OP's page border on parody. So, CS2 doesn't count as a AAA title because it's based on DX11 and doesn't have realtime ray tracing. But apparently this same person is oblivious to the fact that both real-time RT and DX12 translation have been completely usable on Linux for years now. Nvidia helped ship native RT to Linux clients in Wolfenstein: Youngblood, and Proton has supported the majority of DX12 games with RT since before the Steam Deck existed. Kinda makes you glad that this is the final edition, if that's the sort of due diligence being exercised.
- hysan 2y agoI got halfway through it before realizing that it’s just a clickbait article.
- itvision 2y agoYes, look up the author's name. Look at their contributions to the Linux kernel, GCC, KDE, Wine, and many other projects. A total clickbait for sure.
- talldayo 2y agoI don't think that will convince many people. Appealing to authority is one third of rhetoric, Aristotle would say that you need emotion or logic to convince me completely. Speaking for myself, I'm mostly surprised that someone with such an intimate knowledge of Linux has ignored it's developments to this extent. This entire thread is mostly at the consensus that you have tortured many of the talking points in this article beyond taking seriously. Many in this thread have also identified that MacOS and Windows are deficient in several of the criteria you listed. So what even is a desktop, really? An ideal, or a thing people use?
- itvision 2y ago> has ignored it's developments to this extent What have I ignored precisely? Bugs? Regressions? Missing features? Lack of funding? Xorg being deprecated, Wayland being all the rage while being usable only in Gnome and KDE? > Many in this thread have also identified that MacOS and Windows are deficient in several of the criteria you listed. Windows: 2 billion users with no technical background. Linux: 40 million users most of whom are geeks. End of story.
- ryao 2y agoThe X.Org project is not deprecated. It handles both the X.Org X11 server and Wayland. That said, Linux has more users than Windows: https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/ https://gs.statcounter.com/os-market-share/ Android Linux is at 46%, while Windows is at 26%. Other Linux versions have 1%.
- itvision 2y ago
- pxoe 2y agoCS2 is at most AA and mostly just facilitates skin gambling. The way that CS2 was kinda clumsily dropped, replacing a game with another game in kind of an unpolished state, also doesn't suggest that it could even be "AAA". It's low key a public playtest still. Early access. But that's besides that point.
- talldayo 2y agoCan't argue with that. I'm still not super worried for Valve though; between Alyx, Deadlock, the Deck, and Proton, it's pretty clear that CS2 is less of a new norm and more of an outlier too popular to be announced dead and buried yet. Counter Strike has always felt like the drunk uncle of Valve's IP, it would be nice to see him clean up for once but I'm also not upset having him at a holiday party or out at the bar with friends.
- pxoe 2y agoI would be worried for Valve if even with their infinite resources they cannot manage to do right by their most popular game on Steam. There's enough multiplayer shooter games from Valve that are also neglected (tf2, l4d, both have huge issues with bots and hackers) to suggest that it is the norm for them, be it due do disinterest, incompetence, or both.
- teruakohatu 2y agoWine/proton work so well at this point it may as well just be considered just another runtime environment (like Java or the .Net vm).
- out_of_protocol 2y agoBest stable ABI for linux :/ (somehow win32 is indeed best stable runtime for linux)
- ChocolateGod 2y agoSadly true. Somehow people think bundling half of /usr/lib is the solution.
- zahlman 2y agoI'm seeing a lot of endorsement of Wine ITT, which is strange to me because the Linux Mint forums constantly seem to trash it whenever it comes up. (I'm not particularly interested in any programs that would need it.)
- ryao 2y agoYou are probably seeing endorsements of proton rather than vanilla wine. Proton is more than just wine (although wine is the most importantly part) and it works much better than vanilla wine.
- pyrale 2y agoThe one thing that fucks up games for linux is some specific anticheat software, and seeing how e.g. Valorant anticheat works, I'm glad it doesn't.
- orangecat 2y agoAnecdotal, but I've had maybe a 60% success rate running platinum-rated games under Proton, with an unremarkable Ryzen 3900/RTX 2070 desktop. I suspect the further you are from Steam Deck hardware the more trouble you're likely to have. The M4 Mac mini finally convinced me to give up on a Linux desktop for now; the combination of native Mac games, Whisky, and Windows via VMWare works at least as well as Proton for me, and everything else including development is much more convenient, including running Linux VMs when useful.
- mardifoufs 2y agoOkay, that still leaves an insane amount of applications. Games aren't the only thing that people run on their PC. Plus, I think they meant that no native port of AAA games have been published on Linux recently, not that windows games can't run on Linux with additional tooling. though I'm not sure how true that is.
- ninkendo 2y agoAn insane amount of applications are webapps nowadays anyway. Linux has chrome and Firefox which means you get 99% of relevant “applications”.
- ghaff 2y agoOutside of some games and relatively high-end multimedia apps and maybe some dev tools, basically no one cares about the OS. I probably spend 95% in a MacBook using it as a browser.
- gjsman-1000 2y agoSteam also runs on Chromebook; which is easily showing that this is a very shallow victory for Linux on the desktop as a platform. If you can survive with Proton, LibreOffice, and GIMP; you can much more comfortably survive with Proton on ChromeOS, Google Docs, and Photopea. Just hating Windows is not enough of a reason to be a Linux user, and as long as that is the case, Linux will remain niche.
- newdee 2y agoJust hating Windows and wanting to use a beefy dedicated GPU/CPU (not a flimsy feeling Chromebook) is more than enough reason
- geokon 2y agoI mean it's maybe "seamless" if you use a system provided by the top DRM platform. Using wine directly it's unfortunately not very seamless. I don't really play games much but my recent experience hasn't been great. Last week I tried to run Witcher 3 using wine and it took a while to debug. The installer runs immediately and seemlessly - but then it got messy It involved installing `winetricks` which seems to be some service that installs a multitude of driver, libs and software through a clunky unresponsive UI. (not clear where it's being installed from, but #yolo) The necessary libraries I had to deduce from reading forum posts and the errors I got on launch. You then had to go in and make sure to launch the directx 11 version of the game (ie the .exe) buried in a hidden directory (~/.wine/) Is this was "Platinum" means.. i don't want to image what Gold entails
- talldayo 2y agoYou seem to be kinda confused. ProtonDB does not reflect how well Wine runs a program, it reflects how well Proton runs it. If you try to create a Wine environment with the same featureset and patches that Proton has by default, you will waste a lot of time. A lot of things (eg. Powershell, d3d/DXVK, dotnet, C++ redistributables, etc.) come pre-packaged with Proton and therefore require no extra configuration to run a compatible game. What you want is to use a program like Lutris or Bottles to manage your runtime for you, if you're not installing it through Steam. I don't know who put you up to installing Wild Hunt on a vanilla Wine prefix but they sound like someone with a good sense of humor.
- geokon 2y agoThanks for the info! I will take a look at Lutris/Bottles. I just assumed Wine would work directly. It's worked for me most of the time in the past
- anothernewdude 2y agoI don't even bother to check now before buying games.
- jakebasile 2y agoI've only accidentally (via a GeForce Now trial before I gave Steam Remote Play another try) played a video game on a Windows computer in the past two years. The only games that routinely cause problems are those with ridiculous kernel-level anticheat, and I am not interested in those games.
- layer8 2y ago…and, ironically, that’s because they are based on stable Windows APIs.
- deleted 2y ago[deleted]
- itvision 2y agoDirectX and Win32 are Windows APIs. Are you saying Linux has "games" because it excels at ... emulating them? What's the point of using/running Linux then when you have a much higher chance of running games successfully natively? What about dozens if not hundreds of games that use a kernel level anticheat? Pretty much none of them work in Linux. What's the point of native Linux APIs then? That's weird. Wine + DXVK are so good, Linux is GREAT. No, it shows how horrible Linux is when not a single vendor outside of Valve wants to touch it. And everyone who tried to port games to Linux went bankrupt.
- ryao 2y agoProton does such a good job that it is difficult to justify the cost of porting games when they already run on Linux in Proton. That said, Feral Interactive is still porting games to Linux and they have not gone bankrupt: https://www.feralinteractive.com/en/news/?platform=linux https://www.feralinteractive.com/en/news/?platform=linux Proton often runs games better than the native ports, so there is not much of a loss if there are fewer native ports. Furthermore, in a number of cases, Windows games actually run better on Linux in Proton than on Windows. Elden Ring is a fantastic example, as on day 1, it performed about 15% better on Linux in average FPS, and had substantially less stutter if I recall correctly. World of Warcraft is another great example. It is well known to get about 20% better performance on Linux than on Windows: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2_LlSaYNUo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2_LlSaYNUo Minecraft is another such game: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ytgDMgYL0eo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ytgDMgYL0eo If you use AMD GPUs, it is more often the case that Linux will outperform Windows in games, since Valve wrote the shader compiler used for them on Linux and it is fairly amazing: https://steamcommunity.com/games/221410/announcements/detail/1602634609636894200 https://steamcommunity.com/games/221410/announcements/detail... Nvidia is working on improvements for the performance of Windows games running on Linux too. A recent driver release mentions a few such improvements: https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/drivers/details/237587/ https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/drivers/details/237587/ Not all games perform better on Linux than on Windows, although Valve has people actively working on changing this: https://github.com/ValveSoftware/Proton/wiki/Changelog https://github.com/ValveSoftware/Proton/wiki/Changelog
- ThatPlayer 2y agoBecause those are ratings are based on consolidated user ratings, some of them are outdated and still marked Gold. Grand Theft Auto V is Gold, but online doesn't work anymore. Yet users are still giving it a thumbs up because singleplayer works. Apex Legends is also still Gold, and completely no longer works since there's no singleplayer So it's not really ≥80% for top 10 at least.