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Let's put aside the war crimes stuff for a second and think about this as Hackers. Israel's military actions are so awful that they obfuscate the instruments o

Let's put aside the war crimes stuff for a second and think about this as Hackers. Israel's military actions are so awful that they obfuscate the instruments of surveillance and warfare Israel's tech and defense industries have been quietly building. Israel has a captive population at its borders that they and are using to prototype tools to identify and track individuals, identify their familial/professional/social networks, break open their communications and remove any privacy of speech, and the tools to remotely execute (via drone) anyone who ends up marked for termination. All with stunning scale, if not necessarily accuracy. Some of this is mentioned in the WaPo article, some elsewhere (consider coverage of persistent surveillance tech deployed in the West Bank as well as Gaza). This technology is not staying in Israel. The NSO Group's software is probably used by law enforcement near to you to break into iPhones. Elbit systems has been contracted by DHS for surveillance of the US-Mexico border, using camera and drone systems used in Gaza and Lebanon over the past decade. The question you have to ask is whether you're ready to give up your last vestiges of privacy of movement or communication. Are you ready for the chilling effect that comes from that? Are you ready for what a government that has this technology, and the companies and capital that guide it, will ask of you?

threatofrain 2y ago
There is no getting ready according to this line of narrative. It’s bigger than individuals and it’s a matter of destiny.
mhb 2y ago
> Let's put aside the war crimes stuff for a second ...... Israel's military actions are so awful Didn't even make it to a second.
- 0_____0 2y ago
  Those words don't contradict each other, they're part of the same thought.
  - mhb 2y ago
    So QED?
    - 0_____0 2y ago
      I'm more interested to hear what your thoughts on the actual substance of my comment were.
      - mhb 2y ago
        If you are referring to the 20% of your comment after the anti-Israel bits, I agree that intrusive technology, security theater, etc. is concerning. That a company in Israel is a leader, but certainly not the exclusive developer of this stuff is less relevant.
        0_____0 2y ago
        Not to get too deep into it, but calling out Israel for war crimes isn't anti-Israel anymore than being against the US invasion of Iraq in 2003 is Anti-American. Re: the main issue - Worldwide, there are other nations and intelligence agencies that are doing really concerning things (RU, CN mainly), but those countries aren't going to share or sell their intelligence gathering or surveillance tech to the US or other NATO member states. And it's not just NSO group and Elbit. Other Israeli companies that are being used to bolster the surveillance state in Israel: Corsight - facial recognition AI, used in Gaza, attempting to use DNA to reconstruct facial features. "Its advisory board consists only of James Woolsey, a former director of the CIA, and Oliver Revell, a former assistant director of the FBI." - MIT Technology Review Cellebrite - tech to break into phones, used widely by US law enforcement agencies. Oosto (previously Anyvision) - facial recognition technology used in the West Bank, cross linked with social media activity for persons of interest. Contracted by US agencies, they're cagey about who exactly they work with, but their tech at least gets used at border controls. Paragon Systems - founded by Unit 8200 alumni, developed a software suite called Graphite, used to penetrate WhatsApp, Telegram, Signal. Sold to a US company, does business with US law enforcement. Those are the ones that are involved with the US government. Of course there are other entities like Intellexa/Cytrox that are non grata in the US. But it's clear that the surveillance and security focus of the Israeli state, the presence of a captive population with no civil rights, and the proximity to US tech and law enforcement are resulting in a proliferation of tech that's deployed IN THE US, that will go from being used on 'others' to being used to track you and I (assuming you live in the US) at the flip of a switch. We should be deeply skeptical of the US-Israeli relationship. They're developing weapons of oppression, and our government is already deploying them here. This is only possible because of conditions that the US enables, e.g. the continued occupation and subjugation of the populations of Gaza and the West Bank (funded in part by US taxpayers). Israel can't deploy camera networks in a West Bank that it doesn't control. The IDF can't use AI to designate targets in the Gaza Strip when doing so loses it the backing of the US weapons and foreign investment into its companies. We're funding this shit, it's deploying here, and if you're silent about it, I hope you're on the side of whoever is in power when they flip the switch.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
runarberg 2y ago
A few months ago I stated that we might we witnessing the first information technology genocide in history, similar to how the holocaust was the first industrialized genocide. I received a lot of backlash for that statement, people (rightly) pointed out the Rohingya genocide in Myanmar or Nazi use of information tech, and afterwards I wasn’t as convinced. Reading your post, I am convinced again. The use of information technology in the Gaza genocide permutes through the chain of execution, all the way from propaganda, information gathering, controlling the population, targeting civilians, and the killings and the exterminations. There is no genocide where information technology is used for such a wide variety of tasks on such a massive scale, until the Gaza genocide.

threatofrain 2y ago

There is no getting ready according to this line of narrative. It’s bigger than individuals and it’s a matter of destiny.

mhb 2y ago

> Let's put aside the war crimes stuff for a second ...... Israel's military actions are so awful Didn't even make it to a second.

0_____0 2y ago
Those words don't contradict each other, they're part of the same thought.
- mhb 2y ago
  So QED?
  - 0_____0 2y ago
    I'm more interested to hear what your thoughts on the actual substance of my comment were.
    - mhb 2y ago
      If you are referring to the 20% of your comment after the anti-Israel bits, I agree that intrusive technology, security theater, etc. is concerning. That a company in Israel is a leader, but certainly not the exclusive developer of this stuff is less relevant.
      - 0_____0 2y ago
        Not to get too deep into it, but calling out Israel for war crimes isn't anti-Israel anymore than being against the US invasion of Iraq in 2003 is Anti-American. Re: the main issue - Worldwide, there are other nations and intelligence agencies that are doing really concerning things (RU, CN mainly), but those countries aren't going to share or sell their intelligence gathering or surveillance tech to the US or other NATO member states. And it's not just NSO group and Elbit. Other Israeli companies that are being used to bolster the surveillance state in Israel: Corsight - facial recognition AI, used in Gaza, attempting to use DNA to reconstruct facial features. "Its advisory board consists only of James Woolsey, a former director of the CIA, and Oliver Revell, a former assistant director of the FBI." - MIT Technology Review Cellebrite - tech to break into phones, used widely by US law enforcement agencies. Oosto (previously Anyvision) - facial recognition technology used in the West Bank, cross linked with social media activity for persons of interest. Contracted by US agencies, they're cagey about who exactly they work with, but their tech at least gets used at border controls. Paragon Systems - founded by Unit 8200 alumni, developed a software suite called Graphite, used to penetrate WhatsApp, Telegram, Signal. Sold to a US company, does business with US law enforcement. Those are the ones that are involved with the US government. Of course there are other entities like Intellexa/Cytrox that are non grata in the US. But it's clear that the surveillance and security focus of the Israeli state, the presence of a captive population with no civil rights, and the proximity to US tech and law enforcement are resulting in a proliferation of tech that's deployed IN THE US, that will go from being used on 'others' to being used to track you and I (assuming you live in the US) at the flip of a switch. We should be deeply skeptical of the US-Israeli relationship. They're developing weapons of oppression, and our government is already deploying them here. This is only possible because of conditions that the US enables, e.g. the continued occupation and subjugation of the populations of Gaza and the West Bank (funded in part by US taxpayers). Israel can't deploy camera networks in a West Bank that it doesn't control. The IDF can't use AI to designate targets in the Gaza Strip when doing so loses it the backing of the US weapons and foreign investment into its companies. We're funding this shit, it's deploying here, and if you're silent about it, I hope you're on the side of whoever is in power when they flip the switch.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]

runarberg 2y ago

A few months ago I stated that we might we witnessing the first information technology genocide in history, similar to how the holocaust was the first industrialized genocide. I received a lot of backlash for that statement, people (rightly) pointed out the Rohingya genocide in Myanmar or Nazi use of information tech, and afterwards I wasn’t as convinced. Reading your post, I am convinced again. The use of information technology in the Gaza genocide permutes through the chain of execution, all the way from propaganda, information gathering, controlling the population, targeting civilians, and the killings and the exterminations. There is no genocide where information technology is used for such a wide variety of tasks on such a massive scale, until the Gaza genocide.