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>I don't think Americans want a puppet government. The average american doesnt but the elites who feed the average american opinion forming propaganda certainl

by pydry 2y ago

>I don't think Americans want a puppet government. The average american doesnt but the elites who feed the average american opinion forming propaganda certainly do. And this is why the average american would draw this distinction - the opinion forming propaganda they are fed draws this distinction. >We'd be perfectly happy if they just stopped the IP theft, spying, and maybe treated the Chinese people better. America had a perfectly good relationship with China when it was weaker and it did all of the same stuff in the past. Now it has become powerful what was once tolerated is now unforgiveable. For American elites China's real crime is being powerful. It tolerates genocide (Israel), spying on America (Israel), BRUTAL disrespect for human rights on a scale that far eclipses China (Saudi), but what it doesnt tolerate ever is imperial rivals.

talldayo 2y ago
The political and financial elite have not advocated for a puppet government ever. Like Europe benefits from cheap Russian gas, American businesses took full advantage of China's ignorance of human rights. The prevailing American diplomatic strategy since the 70s has been to use globalist reform to force hermit kingdoms to sit at the discussion table. It ultimately worked in the case of the USSR - extreme sanctions and paranoia forced a collapse of their government after their leaders refused to fully cooperate with NATO. China is unique, in that this strategy was squarely aimed at them but ended up being turned around completely. China used their autocratic authority to embrace international trade and create incentives to develop a surplus even when their own citizens couldn't keep up with enough demand. Where the USSR denied progress in civilian industries, China embraced and sponsored it. Capitalism saw the benefits, cheap plastic garbage started getting shipped worldwide, and the free market became addicted to unsustainable, low-margin products that were often made in the hands of indentured political ideologues. It's a problem you can solve without a "puppet government" if you create a reasonable basis of accountability and negotiation for both countries. America doesn't reject that, China does. > For American elites China's real crime is being powerful. America tolerates all sorts of morally reprehensible and powerful nations. We sell half of them weapons and then turn around and deny responsibility on a regular basis. China knows they could be an American ally... if it benefit them. The whataboutism spread by the CCP is meant to frustrate American nationalist sentiments, but it doesn't explain why their approach is superior. Truly, China can be as powerful as they want, as long as their interests are aligned with the international community and not the other way around. If the world lets China use their strength to decide who is morally correct, then it's the international community that is the puppet government.
BobbyJo 2y ago
We are tolerating China just fine no? Aren't we one of China's biggest trading partners?

by pydry 2y ago

talldayo 2y ago

The political and financial elite have not advocated for a puppet government ever. Like Europe benefits from cheap Russian gas, American businesses took full advantage of China's ignorance of human rights. The prevailing American diplomatic strategy since the 70s has been to use globalist reform to force hermit kingdoms to sit at the discussion table. It ultimately worked in the case of the USSR - extreme sanctions and paranoia forced a collapse of their government after their leaders refused to fully cooperate with NATO. China is unique, in that this strategy was squarely aimed at them but ended up being turned around completely. China used their autocratic authority to embrace international trade and create incentives to develop a surplus even when their own citizens couldn't keep up with enough demand. Where the USSR denied progress in civilian industries, China embraced and sponsored it. Capitalism saw the benefits, cheap plastic garbage started getting shipped worldwide, and the free market became addicted to unsustainable, low-margin products that were often made in the hands of indentured political ideologues. It's a problem you can solve without a "puppet government" if you create a reasonable basis of accountability and negotiation for both countries. America doesn't reject that, China does. > For American elites China's real crime is being powerful. America tolerates all sorts of morally reprehensible and powerful nations. We sell half of them weapons and then turn around and deny responsibility on a regular basis. China knows they could be an American ally... if it benefit them. The whataboutism spread by the CCP is meant to frustrate American nationalist sentiments, but it doesn't explain why their approach is superior. Truly, China can be as powerful as they want, as long as their interests are aligned with the international community and not the other way around. If the world lets China use their strength to decide who is morally correct, then it's the international community that is the puppet government.

BobbyJo 2y ago

We are tolerating China just fine no? Aren't we one of China's biggest trading partners?