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It took a decade, but the EU has finally achieved what no other major union of countries has done: mandating a single universal connector. As the world's larges

It took a decade, but the EU has finally achieved what no other major union of countries has done: mandating a single universal connector. As the world's largest single consumer market (500 million people), this decision sets a global standard, with the rest of the world following suit. The delay was largely due to intense lobbying from manufacturers, especially Apple, which profited significantly from licensing their proprietary Lightning port. Next up on the EU's list for 2026: Easily Changeable Batteries (you know, what every cell phone 20 years ago had before Apple).

tgma 2y ago
> profited significantly from licensing their proprietary Lightning port. How significant? Doubtful it moves the needle for Apple. People often forget Lightning is much superior to microUSB which was the alternative at the time (also mechanically superior to USB-C), and that Apple was instrumental in widespread USB-C adoption by taking a heat for the longest time on their butterfly MacBooks. And yes, while I am happy with USB-C today, I totally believe mandating it does stifle innovation. Imagine if we mandated microUSB in 2010.
- randunel 2y ago
  Which other company sells short USB cables for £60?
  - tgma 2y ago
    Are you referring to Apple Thunderbolt cables? They are active cables with circuits in them. Otherwise, I am not sure which cable you are referring to that sells for that much. I understand as a consumer you get emotional and pissed, but even if true, that is a drop in the bucket and not "significant" profit for Apple. The true value of MFi licensing to Apple would be influencing the accessory market, not peanuts in dongle sales.
    - bmicraft 2y ago
      $5 Type c cables also have "circuits" in them. It's not that hard or expensive to implement an e-markee chip.
      - tgma 2y ago
        If you think it is the same, then you are free not to purchase the cable from Apple. Either way to claim that such cable constitutes "significant" revenue to Apple Inc. is just hyperbolic/preposterous. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LBWnb0ZIlEA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LBWnb0ZIlEA
        econ 2y ago
        The revenue is in one more chain locking the user into the ecosystem. Hard to quantify.
        randunel 2y ago
        You're taking things literally, but the point is that everything is overpriced with apple and they're getting away with it because of the cult following they've cultured and are now milking. In my previous comment, I simply picked one of the ridiculous things cult followers pay for. They're going to keep milking their followers no matter how ridiculous each point seems when someone puts it in writing. That's how "the needle moves".
        tgma 2y ago
        So you're suggesting because everything is overpriced with Apple and they are a cult leader (your opinion) the government should step in and dictate the price and behavior? Last time I checked some European countries have not only tax-free churches, they also facilitate collecting taxes and funding them. Instead of policing cults and dictating pricing, I suggest simply not purchasing what you don't like. (While we are on the subject of forcing behavior changes, let's mandate air conditioning and a singular electrical wall outlet. Why not?)
  - wqaatwt 2y ago
    So you’re saying that USB-C cables are more expensive than Lightning ones? Not that AFAIK iPhones support Thunderbolt anyway so how is this relevant?
- dijit 2y ago
  Agreed. Lightening was most likely a combination of: * The connection interface was superior to USB-A Micro/Mini in both size and reliability - and this was the contemporary connector in 2012. * They had undergone a physical connector change only once, and it was not received well by vendors. * USB-C was not anywhere near ready for the iPhone 5, and the 40 pin would not do well in that type of device. * USB-C and Lightening are comparable on size and reliability (saying nothing about speed) - so even after USB- started gaining adoption there was not a strong incentive to switch over. It wasn't superior. * USB-C charging only would be fine, but people would expect drivers for storage, HDMI, radio docks etc. Easy to undersell this effort in hindsight. I also doubt that it was a profit motive. let’s not forget that Apple themselves helped design USB-C and pushed for it to be the standard. I guess they couldn't wait for it to be ready, and given the iPhone 5 came out in 2012 and the first commercially successful USB-C devices came in 2016 I guess they were right.
  - tgma 2y ago
    Precisely. The irony is that almost all non-MacBook computer still come with at least one USB-A port to this day. If it weren't for Apple pushing USB-C only on the MacBook, that connector's universal adoption as the primary data/video interface wouldn't have been as widespread. They legitimized the connector by forcing it on MacBook users.
  - callc 2y ago
    > I also doubt that it was a profit motive. One of the most profitable companies in the world trying to build more of a moat of incompatibilities with the rest of the non-apple world with no profit or ulterior motive? /s Once a for-profit company gets large enough doing anything other than “maximize profit up to the point of illegality” becomes a Herculean task. It’s a natural consequence of capitalism, greed, and large organizations. Good on EU for being a counter-balance force
  - DerekL 2y ago
    * Lightning (no e)
- viraptor 2y ago
  > People often forget Lightning is much superior to microUSB which was the alternative at the time At the time, yes. But not for years now. Apple could've changed the path by opening this as a standard but choose not to. > Imagine if we mandated microUSB in 2010. Apple would include an extra/expanded connector like a number of other device producers. Then they'd talk to the other large companies about moving to a new standard just like the currently introduced law proposes. This is not a "you must use usb-c" law, but rather "you must figure out how to get along" law. Also, this pretty much happened, just without regulation. EU at the time effectively said "figure it out, or else" and microUSB became a standard for years. Now they felt like they need to push harder.
  - burnerthrow008 2y ago
    > Apple could've changed the path by opening this as a standard but choose not to. Sure, and Apple could have shipped a free pony to every child on earth. But expecting them to do so is childish.
    - viraptor 2y ago
      It's not for our benefit. They had a better connector and decided to keep it proprietary. If they made it an open standard, there's a chance the regulation would be enforcing lightning for everyone. They don't get to both keep it proprietary and complain about being forced to sell standard things.
  - tgma 2y ago
    > This is not a "you must use usb-c" law, but rather "you must figure out how to get along" law. No, this is exactly "you must use USB-C law." Please don't reframe it as a strawman. > Apple would include an extra/expanded connector like a number of other device producers. They did mandate such thing IIRC, just not forced directly on device, which is a slightly better IMO, to mandate how something is sold rather than dictating how the device should be built.
    - viraptor 2y ago
- greatgib 2y ago
  So superior that I did rarely see a lightning cable that didn't had its connector broken in one or two years maximum...
  - tokinonagare 2y ago
    I had to change a lightning cable once, after years of daily use, and it wasn't the connector the issue. I wonder what was the people owing the cable you saw did with them...
    - lloeki 2y ago
      Some people just butcher cables, piles of them; but that's irrespective of port technology.
  - tgma 2y ago
    Mechanically broken? I have never seen a Lightning break or get too loose in years. I’ve used both connectors extensively. USB-C I’ve faced loose female connectors, broken female connector to the degree that it heated up the MacBook because it generated interrupts for kernel to handle. On the male side I’ve seen bent cables and of course even without mechanical failure there are cables that should work and just don’t for different use cases (Charge but no data. Data but no alt mode video.) We should look at data but USB-C anecdotally have been an order of magnitude worse for me and people around me.
alkonaut 2y ago
I’m happy to have batteries glued to my smartphone (replaceable, but only in the sense the main logic board is replaceable) if it saves even a few % in weight, rigidity or how waterproof it is. The times when phones had battery hatches were the dark ages. I used 2-3 batteries in every smartphone I used and the replacement was always cheap ($50 or so). That’s enough. Adding the possibility to user-replace it for half that by adding some design compromise like a hatch wouldn’t be interesting to consumers. For every battery replaced, how many screens are replaced? 3? Yet no one seems to be talking about making it easier for end users to replace screens?
- josho 2y ago
  The real next step is standardizing battery sizes. Think of all the other gadgets that have replaceable batteries. (Eg. Power tools) Most of those batteries are standard at the wholesale level. But a thin plastic layer added to house the battery makes it proprietary due to the connection interface. And now it’s a world of incompatible batteries and price gouging for replacement batteries.
  - tgma 2y ago
    I guess the real next step is to keep selling thick old devices as the EU SKU and modern innovative stuff to the rest of the world. Apple already has to do that on the software side for their AI features. Given the current GDP/capita trajectory of the EU, that is likely all they will be able to afford anyway. :)
    - Rexxar 2y ago
      I recommend you to read this Aesop's fable: https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Fables_of_Æsop_(Jacobs)/The_Dog_and_the_Wolf https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Fables_of_Æsop_(Jacobs)/T...
      - tgma 2y ago
        Except your analogy does not hold because you can simply choose not to buy the product with the connector you don't like or can no longer afford as a result of socialism. It appears much harder to opt out of said socialism without leaving the country though, so read that again with this pretext perhaps?
oulipo 2y ago
At least for e-bike battery, that's precisely what we're building at https://get.gouach.com https://get.gouach.com :)
oloila 2y ago
Every battery is changeable. The fact that you can't replace them without a screwdriver and a heat gun doesn't make them irreplaceable. You're also unlikely to fix the TV, but you have no questions about it.
- ravendug 2y ago
  This is stating the obvious without addressing the point. It is implicit that we are discussing user replaceable batteries. Your average user does not own a heat gun or the knowledge of how to use it to replace their own battery. Removing the requirement for the majority of users to have to take their phone to a technician to do the replacement will undoubtedly result in less eWaste. To the best of my knowledge, my TV does not contain a consumable battery which is core to its primary function. Sure the display panel and other components may have a finite lifetime but these are long enough to not be considered consumables by either consumers or manufacturers like batteries are.
  - burnerthrow008 2y ago
    I would wager that at least 50% of the population owns a heat gun. They just call it something different.
  - oloila 2y ago
    User-replaceable batteries will require additional space on your phone's body. I'm not willing to trade convenience for a rare battery replacement case. If you want - you can buy modular phones, pay for that, don't force other people And I'll go and pay a couple dozen bucks for this work, like all normal people. But eco-activists are starting to say that eWaste is caused by non-replaceable batteries, not by the obsolescence of devices. No one will change the battery in an outdated device, even if it is replaceable.
    - arez 2y ago
      eWaste is caused by all kinds of things and one thing that is easily solvable is replaceable batteries. I also hope that it will be forced for all phones, people shouldn't be able to pay a little extra to destroy the planet
Stevvo 2y ago
"As the world's largest single consumer market (500 million people)" What, China doesn't exist? India too?
- goodpoint 2y ago
  On HN only US exists.
- wqaatwt 2y ago
  Europeans still have significantly more money and therefore consume more than the Chinese. India is not even remotely close because of how poor it is.
speleding 2y ago
Those changeable batteries were horribly unreliable! I've had over a dozen different brand of phones and eventually they all started to black out occasionally when the connections got corroded or otherwise loosened up. I really hope soldered batteries stay an option or I will be buying my phone outside the EU.
- thomassmith65 2y ago
  Outside the EU, in many cases, device batteries will also be user-swappable. Companies like Apple greatly prefer (well, when they're not petulantly trying to show the EU who's boss) to ship one design to the whole world. It's a nuisance to have separate design processes, manufacturing processes, marketing materials, etc. This is why, once it became affordable, the entire industry started making auto-switching power supplies. Unless hardware manufacturers finagle a way to continue selling soldered batteries in the EU, user-swappable batteries will become the norm again.
mensetmanusman 2y ago
Apple profited from their phones, nothing was close to as good as lightning when it came out. They showed the world how nice it would be with a simple reversible charger. Thankfully usb c is standardized but it wouldn’t have happened nearly as quickly without Apple.
frikskit 2y ago
How is Europe the largest single consumer market at 500 million people? Are you unaware of China, and also India? What am I missing? Even if you measure in economic size and not population, you’re still wrong. I’m also curious, how and when will it be decided that it’s eventually time to move onto a new/better standard? If the law came into force 20 years ago, would we still be stuck with the standard of that time? Who decides when a new standard is worth upgrading? Edit: I see now others mentioned China already.
- wqaatwt 2y ago
  They spend more per capita than the Chinese do? Are you unaware of that? Seems rather obvious.. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_consumer_markets https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_consumer_mar...
eternityforest 2y ago
I think part of the delay is just that USB-C didn't really take off for cheap devices until like 2018. Before that there was no connector that was suitable for a universal charger, we barely even knew if dynamic voltage negotiation was going to be safe or not(I remember thinking it was going to try devices with bugs). MicroUSB was craptastic, barrel jacks aren't voltage standardized in practice, but pretty much every average consumer adores USB-C. It's like a shining example of what tech can be. If you made a law requiring any other connector, people would probably be angry. We could probably learn to live with a barrel jack, but most likely wrong voltage connection accidents would have happened at least occasionally.

tgma 2y ago

> profited significantly from licensing their proprietary Lightning port. How significant? Doubtful it moves the needle for Apple. People often forget Lightning is much superior to microUSB which was the alternative at the time (also mechanically superior to USB-C), and that Apple was instrumental in widespread USB-C adoption by taking a heat for the longest time on their butterfly MacBooks. And yes, while I am happy with USB-C today, I totally believe mandating it does stifle innovation. Imagine if we mandated microUSB in 2010.

randunel 2y ago
Which other company sells short USB cables for £60?
- tgma 2y ago
  Are you referring to Apple Thunderbolt cables? They are active cables with circuits in them. Otherwise, I am not sure which cable you are referring to that sells for that much. I understand as a consumer you get emotional and pissed, but even if true, that is a drop in the bucket and not "significant" profit for Apple. The true value of MFi licensing to Apple would be influencing the accessory market, not peanuts in dongle sales.
  - bmicraft 2y ago
    $5 Type c cables also have "circuits" in them. It's not that hard or expensive to implement an e-markee chip.
    - tgma 2y ago
      If you think it is the same, then you are free not to purchase the cable from Apple. Either way to claim that such cable constitutes "significant" revenue to Apple Inc. is just hyperbolic/preposterous. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LBWnb0ZIlEA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LBWnb0ZIlEA
      - econ 2y ago
        The revenue is in one more chain locking the user into the ecosystem. Hard to quantify.
      - randunel 2y ago
        You're taking things literally, but the point is that everything is overpriced with apple and they're getting away with it because of the cult following they've cultured and are now milking. In my previous comment, I simply picked one of the ridiculous things cult followers pay for. They're going to keep milking their followers no matter how ridiculous each point seems when someone puts it in writing. That's how "the needle moves".
        tgma 2y ago
        So you're suggesting because everything is overpriced with Apple and they are a cult leader (your opinion) the government should step in and dictate the price and behavior? Last time I checked some European countries have not only tax-free churches, they also facilitate collecting taxes and funding them. Instead of policing cults and dictating pricing, I suggest simply not purchasing what you don't like. (While we are on the subject of forcing behavior changes, let's mandate air conditioning and a singular electrical wall outlet. Why not?)
- wqaatwt 2y ago
  So you’re saying that USB-C cables are more expensive than Lightning ones? Not that AFAIK iPhones support Thunderbolt anyway so how is this relevant?
dijit 2y ago
Agreed. Lightening was most likely a combination of: * The connection interface was superior to USB-A Micro/Mini in both size and reliability - and this was the contemporary connector in 2012. * They had undergone a physical connector change only once, and it was not received well by vendors. * USB-C was not anywhere near ready for the iPhone 5, and the 40 pin would not do well in that type of device. * USB-C and Lightening are comparable on size and reliability (saying nothing about speed) - so even after USB- started gaining adoption there was not a strong incentive to switch over. It wasn't superior. * USB-C charging only would be fine, but people would expect drivers for storage, HDMI, radio docks etc. Easy to undersell this effort in hindsight. I also doubt that it was a profit motive. let’s not forget that Apple themselves helped design USB-C and pushed for it to be the standard. I guess they couldn't wait for it to be ready, and given the iPhone 5 came out in 2012 and the first commercially successful USB-C devices came in 2016 I guess they were right.
- tgma 2y ago
  Precisely. The irony is that almost all non-MacBook computer still come with at least one USB-A port to this day. If it weren't for Apple pushing USB-C only on the MacBook, that connector's universal adoption as the primary data/video interface wouldn't have been as widespread. They legitimized the connector by forcing it on MacBook users.
- callc 2y ago
  > I also doubt that it was a profit motive. One of the most profitable companies in the world trying to build more of a moat of incompatibilities with the rest of the non-apple world with no profit or ulterior motive? /s Once a for-profit company gets large enough doing anything other than “maximize profit up to the point of illegality” becomes a Herculean task. It’s a natural consequence of capitalism, greed, and large organizations. Good on EU for being a counter-balance force
- DerekL 2y ago
  * Lightning (no e)
viraptor 2y ago
> People often forget Lightning is much superior to microUSB which was the alternative at the time At the time, yes. But not for years now. Apple could've changed the path by opening this as a standard but choose not to. > Imagine if we mandated microUSB in 2010. Apple would include an extra/expanded connector like a number of other device producers. Then they'd talk to the other large companies about moving to a new standard just like the currently introduced law proposes. This is not a "you must use usb-c" law, but rather "you must figure out how to get along" law. Also, this pretty much happened, just without regulation. EU at the time effectively said "figure it out, or else" and microUSB became a standard for years. Now they felt like they need to push harder.
- burnerthrow008 2y ago
  > Apple could've changed the path by opening this as a standard but choose not to. Sure, and Apple could have shipped a free pony to every child on earth. But expecting them to do so is childish.
  - viraptor 2y ago
    It's not for our benefit. They had a better connector and decided to keep it proprietary. If they made it an open standard, there's a chance the regulation would be enforcing lightning for everyone. They don't get to both keep it proprietary and complain about being forced to sell standard things.
- tgma 2y ago
  > This is not a "you must use usb-c" law, but rather "you must figure out how to get along" law. No, this is exactly "you must use USB-C law." Please don't reframe it as a strawman. > Apple would include an extra/expanded connector like a number of other device producers. They did mandate such thing IIRC, just not forced directly on device, which is a slightly better IMO, to mandate how something is sold rather than dictating how the device should be built.
  - viraptor 2y ago
greatgib 2y ago
So superior that I did rarely see a lightning cable that didn't had its connector broken in one or two years maximum...
- tokinonagare 2y ago
  I had to change a lightning cable once, after years of daily use, and it wasn't the connector the issue. I wonder what was the people owing the cable you saw did with them...
  - lloeki 2y ago
    Some people just butcher cables, piles of them; but that's irrespective of port technology.
- tgma 2y ago
  Mechanically broken? I have never seen a Lightning break or get too loose in years. I’ve used both connectors extensively. USB-C I’ve faced loose female connectors, broken female connector to the degree that it heated up the MacBook because it generated interrupts for kernel to handle. On the male side I’ve seen bent cables and of course even without mechanical failure there are cables that should work and just don’t for different use cases (Charge but no data. Data but no alt mode video.) We should look at data but USB-C anecdotally have been an order of magnitude worse for me and people around me.

alkonaut 2y ago

I’m happy to have batteries glued to my smartphone (replaceable, but only in the sense the main logic board is replaceable) if it saves even a few % in weight, rigidity or how waterproof it is. The times when phones had battery hatches were the dark ages. I used 2-3 batteries in every smartphone I used and the replacement was always cheap ($50 or so). That’s enough. Adding the possibility to user-replace it for half that by adding some design compromise like a hatch wouldn’t be interesting to consumers. For every battery replaced, how many screens are replaced? 3? Yet no one seems to be talking about making it easier for end users to replace screens?

josho 2y ago
The real next step is standardizing battery sizes. Think of all the other gadgets that have replaceable batteries. (Eg. Power tools) Most of those batteries are standard at the wholesale level. But a thin plastic layer added to house the battery makes it proprietary due to the connection interface. And now it’s a world of incompatible batteries and price gouging for replacement batteries.
- tgma 2y ago
  I guess the real next step is to keep selling thick old devices as the EU SKU and modern innovative stuff to the rest of the world. Apple already has to do that on the software side for their AI features. Given the current GDP/capita trajectory of the EU, that is likely all they will be able to afford anyway. :)
  - Rexxar 2y ago
    I recommend you to read this Aesop's fable: https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Fables_of_Æsop_(Jacobs)/The_Dog_and_the_Wolf https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Fables_of_Æsop_(Jacobs)/T...
    - tgma 2y ago
      Except your analogy does not hold because you can simply choose not to buy the product with the connector you don't like or can no longer afford as a result of socialism. It appears much harder to opt out of said socialism without leaving the country though, so read that again with this pretext perhaps?

oulipo 2y ago

At least for e-bike battery, that's precisely what we're building at https://get.gouach.com https://get.gouach.com :)

oloila 2y ago

Every battery is changeable. The fact that you can't replace them without a screwdriver and a heat gun doesn't make them irreplaceable. You're also unlikely to fix the TV, but you have no questions about it.

ravendug 2y ago
This is stating the obvious without addressing the point. It is implicit that we are discussing user replaceable batteries. Your average user does not own a heat gun or the knowledge of how to use it to replace their own battery. Removing the requirement for the majority of users to have to take their phone to a technician to do the replacement will undoubtedly result in less eWaste. To the best of my knowledge, my TV does not contain a consumable battery which is core to its primary function. Sure the display panel and other components may have a finite lifetime but these are long enough to not be considered consumables by either consumers or manufacturers like batteries are.
- burnerthrow008 2y ago
  I would wager that at least 50% of the population owns a heat gun. They just call it something different.
- oloila 2y ago
  User-replaceable batteries will require additional space on your phone's body. I'm not willing to trade convenience for a rare battery replacement case. If you want - you can buy modular phones, pay for that, don't force other people And I'll go and pay a couple dozen bucks for this work, like all normal people. But eco-activists are starting to say that eWaste is caused by non-replaceable batteries, not by the obsolescence of devices. No one will change the battery in an outdated device, even if it is replaceable.
  - arez 2y ago
    eWaste is caused by all kinds of things and one thing that is easily solvable is replaceable batteries. I also hope that it will be forced for all phones, people shouldn't be able to pay a little extra to destroy the planet

Stevvo 2y ago

"As the world's largest single consumer market (500 million people)" What, China doesn't exist? India too?

goodpoint 2y ago
On HN only US exists.
wqaatwt 2y ago
Europeans still have significantly more money and therefore consume more than the Chinese. India is not even remotely close because of how poor it is.

speleding 2y ago

Those changeable batteries were horribly unreliable! I've had over a dozen different brand of phones and eventually they all started to black out occasionally when the connections got corroded or otherwise loosened up. I really hope soldered batteries stay an option or I will be buying my phone outside the EU.

thomassmith65 2y ago
Outside the EU, in many cases, device batteries will also be user-swappable. Companies like Apple greatly prefer (well, when they're not petulantly trying to show the EU who's boss) to ship one design to the whole world. It's a nuisance to have separate design processes, manufacturing processes, marketing materials, etc. This is why, once it became affordable, the entire industry started making auto-switching power supplies. Unless hardware manufacturers finagle a way to continue selling soldered batteries in the EU, user-swappable batteries will become the norm again.

mensetmanusman 2y ago

Apple profited from their phones, nothing was close to as good as lightning when it came out. They showed the world how nice it would be with a simple reversible charger. Thankfully usb c is standardized but it wouldn’t have happened nearly as quickly without Apple.

frikskit 2y ago

How is Europe the largest single consumer market at 500 million people? Are you unaware of China, and also India? What am I missing? Even if you measure in economic size and not population, you’re still wrong. I’m also curious, how and when will it be decided that it’s eventually time to move onto a new/better standard? If the law came into force 20 years ago, would we still be stuck with the standard of that time? Who decides when a new standard is worth upgrading? Edit: I see now others mentioned China already.

wqaatwt 2y ago
They spend more per capita than the Chinese do? Are you unaware of that? Seems rather obvious.. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_consumer_markets https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_largest_consumer_mar...

eternityforest 2y ago

I think part of the delay is just that USB-C didn't really take off for cheap devices until like 2018. Before that there was no connector that was suitable for a universal charger, we barely even knew if dynamic voltage negotiation was going to be safe or not(I remember thinking it was going to try devices with bugs). MicroUSB was craptastic, barrel jacks aren't voltage standardized in practice, but pretty much every average consumer adores USB-C. It's like a shining example of what tech can be. If you made a law requiring any other connector, people would probably be angry. We could probably learn to live with a barrel jack, but most likely wrong voltage connection accidents would have happened at least occasionally.