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Literally all Apple needed to do was not have it enabled by default. Sending stuff over the network without asking is why trust in Apple is reduced further and

Literally all Apple needed to do was not have it enabled by default. Sending stuff over the network without asking is why trust in Apple is reduced further and further.

Klonoar 2y ago
Apple already communicates home by default. They never even fixed the macOS app signature check that they said they would, and yet people still choose to use the OS. (And to be clear I’m not even bothered by the signature check) At a certain point you have to figure that they realize it doesn’t matter short of some government entity forcing them to stop. At the very least the protections they put in place (homomorphic encryption, etc) are more than I think most other companies would ever bother doing.
Schiendelman 2y ago
[flagged]
- dan-robertson 2y ago
  The OP is evidence. My phone had it turned on which I think is evidence. Together this feels like reasonably strong evidence but maybe something even stronger is easy to find. Vaguely related: https://markxu.com/strong-evidence https://markxu.com/strong-evidence
  - Schiendelman 2y ago
    I think both of you had it turned on from past OS installs - it's bundled under other search metadata, the config isn't new to 18. And "it's on and I don't remember agreeing" is absolutely not evidence. This is super common - nobody remembers what they enabled a year ago.
    - amatecha 2y ago
      Think about it this way: for people who turn off any & everything that phones home (aka anyone who is frustrated by this new "feature"), the chances of them having turned on something like that upon install is almost nil.
    - lapcat 2y ago
      > I think both of you had it turned on from long past OS installs. It's a brand new feature of iOS 18 and macOS 15. It did not exist in iOS 17 or macOS 14. Moreover, my macOS 15 volume was a totally fresh, clean install on a test Mac.
      - lapcat 2y ago
        By the way, Enhanced Visual Search is also enabled by default in the Xcode iOS 18 simulator.
dan-robertson 2y ago
Not enabling something by default is pretty close to not having it at all. Accessibility is a reasonable exception where it makes sense to have the features even though they are off by default. I mostly think the reaction to this article is overblown because it appeals popular ideas here about big tech. I think one should be wary of Apple’s claims about privacy: the reason is competition with Google and so they want users to be distrustful of the kinds of features that Google are better at implementing (I don’t want to say Apple isn’t trying to do the right thing either – if you look at accessibility, the competition was very bad for a lot of things for a long time and Apple was good despite the lack of commercial pressure). But I think one should also be wary of articles that make you angry and tell you what you suspected all along. (eg see the commenter elsewhere who doesn’t care about the details and is just angry). It’s much easier to spot this kind of rage-bait piece when it is targeting ‘normal people’ rather than the in-group.
- JTyQZSnP3cQGa8B 2y ago
  > Not enabling something by default is pretty close to not having it at all And I care "why" exactly? It was turned on by default on my phone without my consent, it's a privacy violation, nothing else matters in that case.
  - dan-robertson 2y ago
    In the comment you are replying to, I’m trying to explain some of the reasons for the world being the way it is. I’m not trying to convince you to be happy about it.
- lapcat 2y ago
  > But I think one should also be wary of articles that make you angry and tell you what you suspected all along. (eg see the commenter elsewhere who doesn’t care about the details and is just angry). It’s much easier to spot this kind of rage-bait piece when it is targeting ‘normal people’ rather than the in-group. The article was published by an Apple developer and user, i.e., myself, on my personal blog, which is followed mainly by other Apple developers and users. My blog comprises my own personal observations, insights, and opinions. If you see any rage, it would be my own personal rage, and not "bait". Bait for what?

Literally all Apple needed to do was not have it enabled by default. Sending stuff over the network without asking is why trust in Apple is reduced further and further.

Klonoar 2y ago

Apple already communicates home by default. They never even fixed the macOS app signature check that they said they would, and yet people still choose to use the OS. (And to be clear I’m not even bothered by the signature check) At a certain point you have to figure that they realize it doesn’t matter short of some government entity forcing them to stop. At the very least the protections they put in place (homomorphic encryption, etc) are more than I think most other companies would ever bother doing.

Schiendelman 2y ago

[flagged]

dan-robertson 2y ago
The OP is evidence. My phone had it turned on which I think is evidence. Together this feels like reasonably strong evidence but maybe something even stronger is easy to find. Vaguely related: https://markxu.com/strong-evidence https://markxu.com/strong-evidence
- Schiendelman 2y ago
  I think both of you had it turned on from past OS installs - it's bundled under other search metadata, the config isn't new to 18. And "it's on and I don't remember agreeing" is absolutely not evidence. This is super common - nobody remembers what they enabled a year ago.
  - amatecha 2y ago
    Think about it this way: for people who turn off any & everything that phones home (aka anyone who is frustrated by this new "feature"), the chances of them having turned on something like that upon install is almost nil.
  - lapcat 2y ago
    > I think both of you had it turned on from long past OS installs. It's a brand new feature of iOS 18 and macOS 15. It did not exist in iOS 17 or macOS 14. Moreover, my macOS 15 volume was a totally fresh, clean install on a test Mac.
    - lapcat 2y ago
      By the way, Enhanced Visual Search is also enabled by default in the Xcode iOS 18 simulator.

dan-robertson 2y ago

Not enabling something by default is pretty close to not having it at all. Accessibility is a reasonable exception where it makes sense to have the features even though they are off by default. I mostly think the reaction to this article is overblown because it appeals popular ideas here about big tech. I think one should be wary of Apple’s claims about privacy: the reason is competition with Google and so they want users to be distrustful of the kinds of features that Google are better at implementing (I don’t want to say Apple isn’t trying to do the right thing either – if you look at accessibility, the competition was very bad for a lot of things for a long time and Apple was good despite the lack of commercial pressure). But I think one should also be wary of articles that make you angry and tell you what you suspected all along. (eg see the commenter elsewhere who doesn’t care about the details and is just angry). It’s much easier to spot this kind of rage-bait piece when it is targeting ‘normal people’ rather than the in-group.

JTyQZSnP3cQGa8B 2y ago
> Not enabling something by default is pretty close to not having it at all And I care "why" exactly? It was turned on by default on my phone without my consent, it's a privacy violation, nothing else matters in that case.
- dan-robertson 2y ago
  In the comment you are replying to, I’m trying to explain some of the reasons for the world being the way it is. I’m not trying to convince you to be happy about it.
lapcat 2y ago
> But I think one should also be wary of articles that make you angry and tell you what you suspected all along. (eg see the commenter elsewhere who doesn’t care about the details and is just angry). It’s much easier to spot this kind of rage-bait piece when it is targeting ‘normal people’ rather than the in-group. The article was published by an Apple developer and user, i.e., myself, on my personal blog, which is followed mainly by other Apple developers and users. My blog comprises my own personal observations, insights, and opinions. If you see any rage, it would be my own personal rage, and not "bait". Bait for what?