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What repercussions? The goal was to send a public message to journalists and dissidents and they succeeded in doing exactly that.

by paxys 2y ago

delfinom 2y ago
Sent me the message that Saudi Arabia remains a shithole.
ethbr1 2y ago
The huge PR headache that continues to hang over Saudi Arabia to this day. Given their attempts to rebrand into a tourism and entertainment capital, mindshare of "that country and leader who tortured and murdered a journalist" isn't great. Specifically because not doing it, while a thorn in their side, wouldn't have destabilized the state. They did it because they could and they thought they'd get away with it.
- pas 2y ago
  Data please. The default is that people don't fucking care. Especially tourists. MBS can organize music festivals every week and people would go if it's not too expensive. Qatar hosted the world cup in 2022, and guess who was picked just recently to host the cup in 2034. Yes, Saudi Arabia. Just this year, historic milestone. Yeey. :| https://www.unwto.org/news/un-tourism-applauds-saudi-arabia-s-historic-milestone-of-100-million-tourist-arrivals https://www.unwto.org/news/un-tourism-applauds-saudi-arabia-...
  - sofixa 2y ago
    > Qatar hosted the world cup in 2022 And saw relatively low amounts of tourists and views from Europe (top 2 in terms of footballing powerhouses, alongside South America which is generally poorer and less people from there can afford to travel). Just comparing the 22 World cup to the 24 Euros was night and day in terms of coverage, pubs showing the games, viewing parties, etc.
    - pas 2y ago
      I'm painfully aware ... I lost the key to our short term rental somewhere around midnight in Tilburg during the Euro cup, one weekend before the finals and all the hotels/hostels were full in the city (and in Eindhoven and in Berga) ... of course our host's phone was on do-not-disturb, but at least it did not rain that night. Anyway, the point of sportswashing is not direct monetary profits.
ckw 2y ago
Khashoggi was killed one year after the LV shooting, to the day. The theory is that MBS was staying at the Four Seasons at the Mandalay Bay (~6 floors above Paddock’s room) at the invitation of his cousin Alwaleed bin Talal, who owned the Four Seasons at the time of the shooting. The shooting was a distraction from an assassination attempt on MBS, or potentially a way of flushing him out. The conspiracy presumably involved disgruntled Saudi royal family members and businessmen, many of whom were arrested a month later (several also died in suspicious circumstances) including Alwaleed bin Talal, who was ultimately stripped of much of his wealth (~$20 billion) and influence. Presumably Khashoggi was involved, hence the symbolic date of his execution.
- cluckindan 2y ago
  Do you have any legitimate sources for this information?
  - ckw 2y ago
    From O1: Summary of Confirmable vs. Speculative • Confirmed by reputable sources: 1. Dates of the events (Las Vegas shooting: October 1–2, 2017; Khashoggi’s murder: October 2, 2018). 2. Alwaleed bin Talal was a major investor in the Four Seasons (including the top floors at Mandalay Bay). 3. Saudi authorities arrested Alwaleed bin Talal and other elites in November 2017 in a sweeping “anti-corruption” operation. 4. Alwaleed bin Talal eventually lost significant wealth or leverage as a result of that crackdown, though precise figures remain undisclosed. • Not confirmed / purely speculative: 1. MBS staying in the Four Seasons above the Las Vegas shooter. 2. The Las Vegas shooting as a deliberate “distraction” from an assassination attempt. 3. Khashoggi being part of such a plot, or his execution date tying symbolically to the shooting. Re speculations unconfirmed by reputable sources: a good place to start would be rumble. There’s much more to this interpretation of events, and I’m not wed to it by any means, but it has the virtue of explaining countless strange or unexplained aspects of the shooting.
    - cluckindan 2y ago
      So the sources are OpenAI training data and a far-right social media platform. It seems prudent to disregard this conspiracy theory as misinformation.

What repercussions? The goal was to send a public message to journalists and dissidents and they succeeded in doing exactly that.

by paxys 2y ago

What repercussions? The goal was to send a public message to journalists and dissidents and they succeeded in doing exactly that.

delfinom 2y ago

Sent me the message that Saudi Arabia remains a shithole.

ethbr1 2y ago

The huge PR headache that continues to hang over Saudi Arabia to this day. Given their attempts to rebrand into a tourism and entertainment capital, mindshare of "that country and leader who tortured and murdered a journalist" isn't great. Specifically because not doing it, while a thorn in their side, wouldn't have destabilized the state. They did it because they could and they thought they'd get away with it.

pas 2y ago
Data please. The default is that people don't fucking care. Especially tourists. MBS can organize music festivals every week and people would go if it's not too expensive. Qatar hosted the world cup in 2022, and guess who was picked just recently to host the cup in 2034. Yes, Saudi Arabia. Just this year, historic milestone. Yeey. :| https://www.unwto.org/news/un-tourism-applauds-saudi-arabia-s-historic-milestone-of-100-million-tourist-arrivals https://www.unwto.org/news/un-tourism-applauds-saudi-arabia-...
- sofixa 2y ago
  > Qatar hosted the world cup in 2022 And saw relatively low amounts of tourists and views from Europe (top 2 in terms of footballing powerhouses, alongside South America which is generally poorer and less people from there can afford to travel). Just comparing the 22 World cup to the 24 Euros was night and day in terms of coverage, pubs showing the games, viewing parties, etc.
  - pas 2y ago
    I'm painfully aware ... I lost the key to our short term rental somewhere around midnight in Tilburg during the Euro cup, one weekend before the finals and all the hotels/hostels were full in the city (and in Eindhoven and in Berga) ... of course our host's phone was on do-not-disturb, but at least it did not rain that night. Anyway, the point of sportswashing is not direct monetary profits.

ckw 2y ago

Khashoggi was killed one year after the LV shooting, to the day. The theory is that MBS was staying at the Four Seasons at the Mandalay Bay (~6 floors above Paddock’s room) at the invitation of his cousin Alwaleed bin Talal, who owned the Four Seasons at the time of the shooting. The shooting was a distraction from an assassination attempt on MBS, or potentially a way of flushing him out. The conspiracy presumably involved disgruntled Saudi royal family members and businessmen, many of whom were arrested a month later (several also died in suspicious circumstances) including Alwaleed bin Talal, who was ultimately stripped of much of his wealth (~$20 billion) and influence. Presumably Khashoggi was involved, hence the symbolic date of his execution.

cluckindan 2y ago
Do you have any legitimate sources for this information?
- ckw 2y ago
  From O1: Summary of Confirmable vs. Speculative • Confirmed by reputable sources: 1. Dates of the events (Las Vegas shooting: October 1–2, 2017; Khashoggi’s murder: October 2, 2018). 2. Alwaleed bin Talal was a major investor in the Four Seasons (including the top floors at Mandalay Bay). 3. Saudi authorities arrested Alwaleed bin Talal and other elites in November 2017 in a sweeping “anti-corruption” operation. 4. Alwaleed bin Talal eventually lost significant wealth or leverage as a result of that crackdown, though precise figures remain undisclosed. • Not confirmed / purely speculative: 1. MBS staying in the Four Seasons above the Las Vegas shooter. 2. The Las Vegas shooting as a deliberate “distraction” from an assassination attempt. 3. Khashoggi being part of such a plot, or his execution date tying symbolically to the shooting. Re speculations unconfirmed by reputable sources: a good place to start would be rumble. There’s much more to this interpretation of events, and I’m not wed to it by any means, but it has the virtue of explaining countless strange or unexplained aspects of the shooting.
  - cluckindan 2y ago
    So the sources are OpenAI training data and a far-right social media platform. It seems prudent to disregard this conspiracy theory as misinformation.